Mods.. the true meta?

Honestly, in my opinion, unregulated mods are something that hurt this game and the balance of this game almost more than anything else. And one of the worst decisions period. I have good speed secondary mods so not complaining that I don't have them, cause I do. I'm stating that because it's true. Unregulated, uncapped speed secondary mods made the arena more about who has the best mods rather than the best squad composition or strategy. With all other things equal mods are not equal. Not to mention (except in rare circumstances) if a mod doesn't have a speed secondary it is mostly useless. Making the majority of mods useless and completely negating what could have been a strategic strong point of this game... Mod choice. As it is... There is none. The choice, as it is, is speed and speed alone.

And if they continue to be unregulated then 6 & 7 star mods will exacerbate the situation.

Yes I over simplify it because I don't have the exact algorithm of how it really works in the game. A super speed modded 7 star, max ability, max gear team of Ugnaut, CPU, Mob Enforcer, Lobot and Tusken Raider will not beat out a non-speed focused Sith team of similair level/gear/etc. Heck they won't even beta out an under geared one. Team synergy does make a difference, gear makes a difference, zeta makes a difference, but let's assume that a player is trying to compete and has some knowledge on team composition, strengths and weakness.

Over simplification or not are you trying to say that given two teams with the exact same characters, exact same gear, exact same level and exact same Omegas/Zetas/Abilities all vying for let's say a top 200 arena spot so we're not getting silly like making up a team of CPU, Mob Enforcer, Ugnaut, etc and you have one team that is only focused on speed mods (not talking bonus ability only, but primary and secondary) and you let the other team pick what ever mods they feel would give the best chance to win which could be a balance of crit damage, protection, whatever and include some speed too since it's a factor for balance.

Are you saying the speed focused team won't win? Every time. Every darn time. First, second and third shot are so critical since most meta teams either reduce or grant TM based on these and absolutely deflate the other team before they even get a chance to start. If you are saying they won't win then I'm at a loss. If you are saying they will well that to me signifies that speed is over powered at the moment. Is it overpowered by a factor of 2 as I outlined in my simple equation. Probably not. Maybe in some team compositions and against certain teams though maybe it is and even more, but it's a factor and in my opinion a big one that could use some addressing so it was less about speed and more about strategy or team match up and attack order in battle and less about let me pick the right tam and go switch all my mods to speed for them to put them over the top.

Mods are capped though...
Just like you dont bring g10 toons to a g12 fight, you don’t bring +5 average speed mods to a +15 average fight. The only difference is that its easier to hit the lvl/star/gear caps.

"MntMan;c-1545902" wrote:
Yes I over simplify it because I don't have the exact algorithm of how it really works in the game. A super speed modded 7 star, max ability, max gear team of Ugnaut, CPU, Mob Enforcer, Lobot and Tusken Raider will not beat out a non-speed focused Sith team of similair level/gear/etc. Heck they won't even beta out an under geared one. Team synergy does make a difference, gear makes a difference, zeta makes a difference, but let's assume that a player is trying to compete and has some knowledge on team composition, strengths and weakness.

Over simplification or not are you trying to say that given two teams with the exact same characters, exact same gear, exact same level and exact same Omegas/Zetas/Abilities all vying for let's say a top 200 arena spot so we're not getting silly like making up a team of CPU, Mob Enforcer, Ugnaut, etc and you have one team that is only focused on speed mods (not talking bonus ability only, but primary and secondary) and you let the other team pick what ever mods they feel would give the best chance to win which could be a balance of crit damage, protection, whatever and include some speed too since it's a factor for balance.

Are you saying the speed focused team won't win? Every time. Every darn time. First, second and third shot are so critical since most meta teams either reduce or grant TM based on these and absolutely deflate the other team before they even get a chance to start. If you are saying they won't win then I'm at a loss. If you are saying they will well that to me signifies that speed is over powered at the moment. Is it overpowered by a factor of 2 as I outlined in my simple equation. Probably not. Maybe in some team compositions and against certain teams though maybe it is and even more, but it's a factor and in my opinion a big one that could use some addressing so it was less about speed and more about strategy or team match up and attack order in battle and less about let me pick the right tam and go switch all my mods to speed for them to put them over the top.

I would say it completely depends on the teams. There have been past metas where I have taken my arena team into a mirror match and destroyed the opponent 95% of the team even though they had significantly superior mods.

Other metas have made speed more important. But fortunately I am not forced to use an identical team. I have been able to find a different squad that can win every time vs. and opponent with superior mods even giving them fits on defense.

The current meta is WAY more RNG dependant than anything. A faster Vader will boost an opposing Nihilus' TM by debuffing Sion. Then it's RNG as to him reducing cool downs first, or Vader getting to do Culling Blade first. And it's RNG as to who's Palpatine gets the most stuns. I've actually found that a 7* Sion is so beefy/hard to kill that he has cost me mirror matches where I have better mods because I'm poor, and my Sion is squishier at 3*. But Wampa under Rex lead with WAY less speed has been know to give some JTR and Palpatine teams fits.

So again, you are making a drastic oversimplification... when you really just want to complain about mods... which I totally understand.

What you're doing though is confusing RNG with things that are controlled by speed. In some cases yes RNG like if someones cool down is reduced or not or if you can land 3 or 4 debuffs as opposed to only 2 so when you hit them with Culling Blade you get more TM, but speed is such a factor. I think you are too caught up in trying to say I am over simplifying things, which I am fact am, and unable to admit the role speed plays and it's significance. You are not forced to mirror a team. That is true and at the top of the arena there are maybe 4-5 different team make ups which prove that not just one team is 100% meta. That being said of all those 4-5 team compositions that reside up top all of them are maxed for speed. If they're not then maybe, just maybe they got lucky with an odd RNG and they will soon be bounced.

"MntMan;c-1545929" wrote:
What you're doing though is confusing RNG with things that are controlled by speed.

if you've got a 80%+ winpercentage vs a mirror team with superior mods, it's not RNG anymore.

"MntMan;c-1545929" wrote:
What you're doing though is confusing RNG with things that are controlled by speed. In some cases yes RNG like if someones cool down is reduced or not or if you can land 3 or 4 debuffs as opposed to only 2 so when you hit them with Culling Blade you get more TM, but speed is such a factor. I think you are too caught up in trying to say I am over simplifying things, which I am fact am, and unable to admit the role speed plays and it's significance. You are not forced to mirror a team. That is true and at the top of the arena there are maybe 4-5 different team make ups which prove that not just one team is 100% meta. That being said of all those 4-5 team compositions that reside up top all of them are maxed for speed. If they're not then maybe, just maybe they got lucky with an odd RNG and they will soon be bounced.

I'm not confusing anything. There are different metas where speed is more or less important. RNG dependant teams are one thing that can make it less important. The dodge meta was a great example of that.

So speed from mods is... a factor. The question giving this thread it's name is 'are mods the meta'. The answer is no. Character kits will always be the true meta. Since there are characters in game that would still be worthless at +200 speed, but the right team comp can outperform teams with superior speed.

I know this because I've been camped near the top of my arena since the summer of 2016 next to a guy who once every few months shows off his latest +20 speed mod, and in 2.5 years I've never rolled a single one. His team is honestly not the hardest to beat either.

Well I don't know. I'd love to be in your pod or whatever it's called for arena grouping then. Let me tell you about mine. The top 5 people right now are:

- JTR lead, R2, Thrawn, GK and bb8 - All 7 star all G12 all focused on speed
- EP Lead, Scion, Sth Trooper, Vader, DN - All 7 star all G12 all focused on speed
- Asajj Lead, MT, Daka, GK, Spirit - All 7 star all G12 all focused on speed
- JTR Lead, R2, BB8, Thrawn, GK - All 7 star all G12 all focused on speed
- Rex Lead, DN, GK, Thrawn, CLS - All 7 star all G12 all focused on speed even Rex who doens't really even need it as much as others.

When I say focused on speed I mean it. I clicked on every mod. Even at the detriment of getting set bonuses. Mismatched sets just to get speed. All sitting at the top and it's this way every day. Sure the actual people change, but usually the top 20-40 stay in that grouping and all focus on speed. I can assure you not one 3 star Scion even gets a whiff at top 10, though a 5 star scion is in slot 21 right now with an EP lead, but guess how he's modded? You guessed it. In 2.5 years of playing no speed pulls or not in the shop? Seriously? Now who's oversimplifying or stating?

I mean this is the internet so both of us have to defend our original statements to the utter death, but at least I'll admit I've oversimplified and generalized, but it doesn't take away from the over impactfulness of speed in my mind. I even agree that the original statement of mods being meta is not correct. Or heck. Let's stop making speed our enemy. TM related abilities are what drives speed to be the meta in my mind. You want to be fast to make the other team even slower.

Mods have WAY too large of an impact for how rare quality mods are. God mods get you a long way and there is zero skill involved in getting one. I think that is a major point of frustration for some. In the Palp meta very little matters on offense other than a speedy Vader.

"Kyno;c-1545883" wrote:

"MntMan;c-1545879" wrote:
Yes but if gear = a, abilities = b, speed mods are c (not just regular mods, but speed focused primaries and secondaries) and all the other mods are d then the equation is a2 + b2 + c + d2 = Win.

That's the issue. One is weighted much more than the other and has a larger impact that the other. You cannot win if one of your values is zero versus someone who has all other components, but if you have speed you can maybe eek out someone that is a bit stronger in other areas than you so long as that area is not speed.

If you don't agree with this I understand. It may not be where you are in the game, but if you are trying to get to top 20 in the arena it makes sense. If you are trying to be in the top 200 and not as focused on other aspects of the game like being a top 3 or even top 10 in raids in your guild then it is not as much of a factor. I don't mean this as an insult or talking down. I'm far from top 20 myself. I'd like to get there, but like it is for Ricky Bobby, speed is the answer.

It's only weighted so severely because you are over simplifying it.

Those factors would be different depending on the mod you are in.

In arena b, when specifically regarding the leader ability (a zeta) that could matter way more than an above average speed team.

And a being as simple as you state it could be g9-10?? And that will be made up by mods?

I'm sorry its just not that simple of an equation to =win.

You dont even try to account for team synergy and turn order, which again can play a big part in certain game mods.

Except.. im top 10 daily due to speed vs g12s with my g10s.. even if im only 1 point faster.. mods are the deal breaker. If i can get my vader to hit four times before you go.. i win hands down.