New TB no GET 1?

"Starslayer;c-2392509" wrote:

"Ravens1113;c-2392459" wrote:

"Starslayer;c-2392455" wrote:

"scuba;c-2392399" wrote:
as the RA is written the goal of the gear changes is actually not even close to being met and actually made worse by the information we have.

At least 50% of the goals are met. There are 2 goals, one being helping new players. The changes will help new players a lot. With accelerated farming, it was twice as fast than before to get old characters to 7*, now it will be twice as fast as before to get old characters to G12. This is awesome for players who want to get old journey guide characters, for which you only need G12 or less.

For old characters prior to kyro release yes. Any character released after these Economy updates do zero to help the farm as every single toon requires hundreds of kyro salavage starting at G8.

Could we agree that for most players, ‘zero help’ is a sizeable exaggeration, considering recent characters still need carbs and guns on top of kyros ?

Yes they still need carbs and guns, however I personally don't farm either of those anymore. Gear update 1.0 helped a lot with that.

I still run short of Carbs and g11 finishers.

Double lots and/or half cost (same lot size) of those will definitely help me.

As for Kyros, I farm with 50 crystal refreshes every day on 7B (shock prods), purchase computers with GET, and purchase any additional gyros directly for crystals. Between these sources I do fine, getting on average 1 new relic toon/ week. As long as they're releasing fewer than 40 new toons per year, I'll make noticeable progress on my back catalog of toons.

Would it be nice to get some more kyros? Sure. And if I did I'd be growing my crystal collection at a pretty fast clip since my major crystal expense would be gone. If that happened, I'd be free to just buy a couple hundred shards of the latest marquee from shipments.

And if THAT happened, there would be very little difference between myself and the whales.

Would I, personally, love to have a stockpile of 20k kyros of each type? Sure.

Would it be good for the game if I got new toons FtP at the same rate as the whales? No, of course not. Someone has to pay for this game. If everyone spent $20 on their copy to begin playing we might end up at the same amount of money spent as the current system, but people don't do that. That's not the model. And even if it was, that would give CG an incentive to stop supporting this game so that they could make a brand new game and collect your $20 again.

I have my criticisms of the current model of monetization of mobile games, but having the payments roll in over time keeps CG willing to pay the electric bill for the servers. If that means I spend my crystals on Kyros and wait 2.5 months for my new toons to hit 7*, I can live with that.

"MasterSeedy;c-2392525" wrote:
I still run short of Carbs and g11 finishers.

Double lots and/or half cost (same lot size) of those will definitely help me.

As for Kyros, I farm with 50 crystal refreshes every day on 7B (shock prods), purchase computers with GET, and purchase any additional gyros directly for crystals. Between these sources I do fine, getting on average 1 new relic toon/ week. As long as they're releasing fewer than 40 new toons per year, I'll make noticeable progress on my back catalog of toons.

Would it be nice to get some more kyros? Sure. And if I did I'd be growing my crystal collection at a pretty fast clip since my major crystal expense would be gone. If that happened, I'd be free to just buy a couple hundred shards of the latest marquee from shipments.

And if THAT happened, there would be very little difference between myself and the whales.

Would I, personally, love to have a stockpile of 20k kyros of each type? Sure.

Would it be good for the game if I got new toons FtP at the same rate as the whales? No, of course not. Someone has to pay for this game. If everyone spent $20 on their copy to begin playing we might end up at the same amount of money spent as the current system, but people don't do that. That's not the model. And even if it was, that would give CG an incentive to stop supporting this game so that they could make a brand new game and collect your $20 again.

I have my criticisms of the current model of monetization of mobile games, but having the payments roll in over time keeps CG willing to pay the electric bill for the servers. If that means I spend my crystals on Kyros and wait 2.5 months for my new toons to hit 7*, I can live with that.

I never personally said that they should get rid of all bottlenecks as I think the game needs them for many of the reasons you stated.

I simpily pointed out that
1. With the information in the road ahead running the new TB will reduce the flow of a current bottle neck (no GET1 to purchase gear that is needed and is bottlenecked)
2. That the implied goal of speeding up getting to R5+ is not happening by what was released in the RA and with number 1, will actually slow down getting to R5+

"Lumiya;c-2392505" wrote:
I do understand the worries some people have about Kyros etc, I am a bit sceptical myself, but I think that if you don't really need to farm for so long for the other gear anymore you have more energy/time to farm Kyros and the rest.[/b[ While it might not make much of a difference, it might make it maybe a bit easier. I still have many characters that need comlinks etc, so if that goes faster that would already be great! I think we will have to wait and see how it plays out.

All in all I like the RA and what has been announced.

That is my point, this is where I am. I only farm kyro and shards with regular energy

So if these changes are supposed to and I quote:

To help Existing Players get new characters up-to-speed and usable in high-level content

As the game has grown, so has the difficulty and requirements for many events. Bringing a Marquee Character up to viability, in a game where strong squads are often Relic 5+, is a longer road than when we first introduced Marquees many years ago. These changes will help shorten that journey and get characters up to snuff so you can feel confident in using them in a variety of modes sooner.

How is the changes doing this if G12, kyro, and shards are not affected (I am not saying they should be) and if you lose GET1 income?
Loss of GET1 income can actually length the journey and get characters up to snuff when up to snuff is R5+, because now G12 items (for both left and right) that could have been obtained with GET1 will now have to be farmed from nodes

"scuba;c-2392549" wrote:

How is the changes doing this if G12, kyro, and shards are not affected (I am not saying they should be) and if you lose GET1 income?
Loss of GET1 income can actually length the journey and get characters up to snuff when up to snuff is R5+, because now G12 items (for both left and right) that could have been obtained with GET1 will now have to be farmed from nodes

First - we don't know for sure that GET 1 is being removed. That's an assumption. Not an unreasonable one given the verbiage used, but still an assumption. Second, we haven't even seen the gear rewards for this TB yet. What if the gear rewards out-weigh what you could have bought with the 'missing' GET1? We don't know. On top of that we have no idea what the GET3 shipment offerings are going to be. Maybe they completely erase the need for GET1 - maybe you can ultimately buy more of that G12 gear with GET3 than you ever could with GET1.

I get that you're apparently sitting on piles and piles of carbs and stun guns and mk4 comm links because your only bottleneck is kyros. When I was gearing inquisitors my bottle neck was never kyros - it was stun guns and carbs and mk4 comm links. Getting up to G12 was the challenge - getting through G12 to G13 was a familiar and practiced inconvenience, but no where near as irritating as getting stuck behind two stun guns and a carbanti or comm link.

CG never promised to do anything about kyros. They said they were looking at it. If you honestly believe that these changes don't help people get to relics faster, I guess you're entitled to your opinion - I just don't believe the KNOWN facts support that position. You could be right about some things - but your claims are based on an assumption of things we don't know and haven't seen (and won't see until December).

"herd_nerfer;c-2392560" wrote:

"scuba;c-2392549" wrote:

How is the changes doing this if G12, kyro, and shards are not affected (I am not saying they should be) and if you lose GET1 income?
Loss of GET1 income can actually length the journey and get characters up to snuff when up to snuff is R5+, because now G12 items (for both left and right) that could have been obtained with GET1 will now have to be farmed from nodes

First - we don't know for sure that GET 1 is being removed. That's an assumption. Not an unreasonable one given the verbiage used, but still an assumption. Second, we haven't even seen the gear rewards for this TB yet. What if the gear rewards out-weigh what you could have bought with the 'missing' GET1? We don't know. On top of that we have no idea what the GET3 shipment offerings are going to be. Maybe they completely erase the need for GET1 - maybe you can ultimately buy more of that G12 gear with GET3 than you ever could with GET1.

I get that you're apparently sitting on piles and piles of carbs and stun guns and mk4 comm links because your only bottleneck is kyros. When I was gearing inquisitors my bottle neck was never kyros - it was stun guns and carbs and mk4 comm links. Getting up to G12 was the challenge - getting through G12 to G13 was a familiar and practiced inconvenience, but no where near as irritating as getting stuck behind two stun guns and a carbanti or comm link.

CG never promised to do anything about kyros. They said they were looking at it. If you honestly believe that these changes don't help people get to relics faster, I guess you're entitled to your opinion - I just don't believe the KNOWN facts support that position. You could be right about some things - but your claims are based on an assumption of things we don't know and haven't seen (and won't see until December).

My assumption is based on the information provided.
"They" could easily come out and say one way or another if it is happening or what is being done to mitigate the effects of this.

Hoping the gear rewards would make up for this is crazy speak. Gear rewards in any event have only been good one time and that was with the initial release of STR and then they changed it to the garbage that it is now. The best rewards in most events is the currency and is never the gear. Do they drop something good sometimes? Sure, however it is not enough to count on it as an income stream, it is a bonus.

I never asked or said they should do anything about kyros, that was many other people.
The first changes to the gear economy IMO greatly helped with many things as I can just focus on kyro with regular energy.
However again with the information provided it will not help me as an existing play speed up the journey to getting marque units up to snuff.
It is just blowing smoke.
Will it speed up the journey to the 7* gated gear point for newer players? Sure.
Without increasing the shard, kyro and G12 salvage income (again not saying this needs to be changed) you are not speeding the journey to r5 for me, an existing player.

"scuba;c-2392563" wrote:

Without increasing the shard, kyro and G12 salvage income (again not saying this needs to be changed) you are not speeding the journey to r5 for me, an existing player.

Would you call your own experience typical of most players? Without seeing your roster, I get the feeling that you're probably an outlier in terms of roster progression.

"herd_nerfer;c-2392564" wrote:

"scuba;c-2392563" wrote:

Without increasing the shard, kyro and G12 salvage income (again not saying this needs to be changed) you are not speeding the journey to r5 for me, an existing player.

Would you call your own experience typical of most players? Without seeing your roster, I get the feeling that you're probably an outlier in terms of roster progression.

Of players that have been here since the start of the game yes, I would.

There have been very few marquee units released in the last couple years that I couldn't take to the 7* required stopping point with in a few days, and the only thing that slowed that down was kyro.

"scuba;c-2392566" wrote:

"herd_nerfer;c-2392564" wrote:

"scuba;c-2392563" wrote:

Without increasing the shard, kyro and G12 salvage income (again not saying this needs to be changed) you are not speeding the journey to r5 for me, an existing player.

Would you call your own experience typical of most players? Without seeing your roster, I get the feeling that you're probably an outlier in terms of roster progression.

Of players that have been here since the start of the game yes, I would.

There have been very few marquee units released in the last couple years that I couldn't take to the 7* required stopping point with in a few days, and the only thing that slowed that down was kyro.

See but this is the big difference. You are in the game since the beginning, an endgame player where as I am not even in the game for 2 years. Our experiences are very different. All the gear they are going to double will be absolutely needed for me and it will speed up my progression. If I don't have to spend currencies or energy for Carbantis and co, I can use that fully for other things like Kyros because until now I always have to also still farm and buy Kyros etc.

"scuba;c-2392549" wrote:

"Lumiya;c-2392505" wrote:
I do understand the worries some people have about Kyros etc, I am a bit sceptical myself, but I think that if you don't really need to farm for so long for the other gear anymore you have more energy/time to farm Kyros and the rest.[/b[ While it might not make much of a difference, it might make it maybe a bit easier. I still have many characters that need comlinks etc, so if that goes faster that would already be great! I think we will have to wait and see how it plays out.

All in all I like the RA and what has been announced.

That is my point, this is where I am. I only farm kyro and shards with regular energy

So if these changes are supposed to and I quote:

To help Existing Players get new characters up-to-speed and usable in high-level content

As the game has grown, so has the difficulty and requirements for many events. Bringing a Marquee Character up to viability, in a game where strong squads are often Relic 5+, is a longer road than when we first introduced Marquees many years ago. These changes will help shorten that journey and get characters up to snuff so you can feel confident in using them in a variety of modes sooner.

How is the changes doing this if G12, kyro, and shards are not affected (I am not saying they should be) and if you lose GET1 income?
Loss of GET1 income can actually length the journey and get characters up to snuff when up to snuff is R5+, because now G12 items (for both left and right) that could have been obtained with GET1 will now have to be farmed from nodes

I think the problem just once again comes down to the fact that they don't play their game at a high level. "Strong squads" are not r5+. "Standard squads" are now r5. G12 is useless in almost all game modes for almost all characters. But this is also from the company that said datacrons were added so that our brand new characters could be used from day 1.