So am I the only one not thrilled about the new Loyal trait?

@DeceivedComet19 

Alas, but that's good to know. I'll be sure to avoid that trait for any of my poly Sims. Thanks for testing this out!

(And yes, I absolutely see your point about how equating monogamous with loyal is not exactly presenting polyamory in the best possible light!)

https://answers.ea.com/t5/Bug-Reports/NEEDS-SAVES-Sims-autonomously-do-mean-interactions-for-no-reason/td-p/9821620/page/13

For info, since the loyal trait is mentioned in the thread title, just incase anyone is experiencing a bug with it, if it's making your Sims fall out here is a link to the thread for that issue. It's been merged with an existing thread about Sims being excessively mean to each other.

@simsplayer818 

Thank you. I… haven’t patched yet and will put it off.

Oh my gosh why is everything so broken

I'm not a fan of traits in the Sims 4. Asmara's brilliant video essay, "So...What Happened to The Sims 4? | Part Two: The Downfall," with 216,000+ views on YouTube eloquently summarizes the difference between Sims 4 and Sims 3 traits. I would also add that true personality needs both sliders for diametric attributes (active/lazy, shy/outgoing, etc.) for core personality that determines AI and animations used AND traits on top for additional depth. The Sims really needs both.

Video Link: https://youtu.be/aSyeb5RnWXg?t=505

I actually like this trait, only because I could barely have my sims in rooms with others without them autonomously flirting around their SO's and them having negative moodlets for ages and feeling randomly betrayed being around their spouse awhile after that. I cannot imagine this happening in my real life monogamous marriage where I flirt around my spouse in the same convo or room lol, so I was really hoping for a fix like this. There should be entirely different relationship structures for poly relationships but I'm kind of stoked that purely monogamous ones are actually an option now and my sims can mingle again without me being worried that they'll randomly flirt with strangers.

So, to your point, I did playtest the trait and Loyal Sims very much can still flirt with people who aren't their SOs, they just get a tense moodlet that lasts a long time when they do. The equation of being loyal with monogamy still leans into widespread negative stereotypes about people who are polyamorous that simply aren't true, and this is a pattern that has been present for years as the Player trait from completing the serial romantic aspiration also leans into this idea that people must be "playing the field" if they have multiple romantic interests who are okay with that dynamic. That is why I'm very unhappy with how this trait is supposed to function even if it weren't broken right now.

In my opinion, I think the romantic aspect of the loyal trait should be ditched, and a new option under the sexuality menu in CAS should be added to determine if a Sim does or does not want monogamy.

I just don't like it because of the implication that being disloyal to friends & family is apparently the norm. Why do we need a trait to stop Sims from flirting with every random stranger that walks by regardless of relationship status and insulting their friends even if they're best friends?

(side note, why can we only have one best friend? They should just lift the cap on both soulmates and best friends)

I feel like the default should be to not autonomously be mean to everyone you know while flirting with strangers. Then if they want to make certain traits flip that around - noncommittal, mean, or a new one - fine. But why should my family-oriented dog-loving genius be incapable of being trustworthy?