Re: Aim assist is aim bot, we have data now...

@dioangel This... is a confusing rant.

#1. The MnK community is the one asking for change or demanding to be catered to. I personally agree that there should be no controllers or Aim Assist in their lobbies but I also don't care. It's the MnK that wants Apex to change for them.

#2. I think you mixed equity and equality up since equality is something you're asking for here. Equal resources and an equal opportunity to succeed provided you're the better player. I think that's what you want? Thats equality unless I've misunderstood the word.

#3. Everything else you have to say is political nonsense. Even the above points were a little political. Our ways of life were flawed in the past, they're flawed now, and they'll be flawed in the future. The only difference will be which group is whining about things being "worse" or "bad."

@dioangelPlease keep your weird politics to yourself. Apex forums are not a place for that.

Since you brought it up though,that’s not how the world works. Some people are born into poverty, while others are born into wealth and have every advantage at their fingertips. Life isn’t fair, but that doesn’t mean that it should be perpetuated.

@dioangel

"Teach a man to fish..."

I would buy that garbage if any rich person anywhere ever did anything that looked like "teaching a man to fish." It's a platitude they roll out when they want to use their wealth to distance themselves from any kind of social responsibility or tax liability. Because they seem to universally believe that there is no such thing as "rich enough."

But @RaginSam is right. Let's leave the politics out of the forums.

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@RaginSam wrote:

@dioangelPlease keep your weird politics to yourself. Apex forums are not a place for that.

Since you brought it up though,that’s not how the world works. Some people are born into poverty, while others are born into wealth and have every advantage at their fingertips. Life isn’t fair, but that doesn’t mean that it should be perpetuated.

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lol, you say that then immediately engage, all I read from the 3 of you are the same excuses underperformers use... take that as you will

So based on your words, roller players should be able to demand the stoppage of super gliding, tap strafing and all the other busted movement mechanics PC players have that roller players don't and tell them to just "git gud" because they should be able to play the game without all that special movement which gives advantages - Correct? 

And by using those movements they are actually hindering themselves from playing the game the way it was meant to be played and not allowing themselves to get better?  

That they are all trash cause they can't play the game the way it was meant to play? et cetera. 

I remember when a hint of certain movements asked to be removed from console players,  the PC base got really upset. What? MnK players got upset when roller players claimed unfair advantage to all the key binding, movement advantages and aim advantage from distant MnK provides.... wow, who knew. 

It always feels like some MnK players will always cry out until every single advantage belongs to them. Shame on you roller players for having one advantage over MnK players, whom have many advantages, for shame! 

If you want to cry for something, try crying for separate input lobbies. The two inputs do not belong together period - that is the real issue. Cry for that, don't cry for something that has been in the game for roller players since the beginning that is needed to combat the way the inside of a roller works. Do the research on it. 

All the movement tech is available to Controller players. You might have to change binds, but it's still there. I don't think there's anything a MnK player can do that a Controller can't at this point. Plus, they're not "given" to MnK players, it's just inherently easier to do with MnK. Aim Assist however IS given to Controller players, and is exclusively available to them. Big difference.

Hypothetically, take away Aim Assist, how would controller player do against Mouse users? How about at the Pro level? Would Pros still be using Controllers if they weren't given any Assist? Probably not. So we have to start from there. Aim Assist is meant to shrink the gap between the two inputs, not to make them even. It's a very flawed design philosophy trying to make the two inputs balanced. If you want to be at the top level on PC, then you should have to get better with MnK. Not sure why every game just gives Assist to Controller players on PC now.

About MnK players complaining about tap-strafing being removed. At first, it was believed that it was exclusive to MnK players, so the ones using it were MnK players. Now that it's better understood, and Controller players can use it, they would complain as well.

Personally I think the "movement tech" in this game is all pretty much unintended. With 20 tick servers, people warp around too much. I think they need to clean it up. Either make it something that's built into the game and accessible, or remove it.

The bottom line, as always, it's not about being fair. It's about selling skins in the game. It's fine if you want to make the game more accessible and all, but then the game has to be designed around that. If the only satisfaction from playing can be derived from winning fights, then people are going to fight over things like the amount of Assist. It also promotes people to cheat. Might seem abstract, but I believe that's how it gets solved in the end. Screw competitive gaming.

@ComicBookGuy2727you're comparing a soft aimbot and some movement bug (that almost no one use except streamers because you actually need skill not like aimbot assist) , if you can't see the difference then welp.

 i'm all in for input lobbies , roller player should all be on console lobbies.



and btw you can do most movement bug on controller aswell , but since you can't aim by yourself guess you can't do any move either lmao

You seem to be completely unable to understand the argument. 

1. MNK arent the ones asking for catering, they are asking for change yes, the change that they take away the catering for controller users getting soft aimbot, cause they are inferior at the game. How they do this is irrelevant, but ultimately for fairness, soft aimbot has no bearing on a comp shooter and comp game in general. If consoles play only with each other and with AA thats fine. They could also simply remove aim assist and allow you to plug a MnK into your console and be done with it, you choose what you want and both platforms can do what they like.

2.Equality isnt giving one platform a huge advantage over the other, cause the hardware is inferior for the task. It would be allowing both platforms to use the superior hardware aka MnK or seperating them so it doesnt impact em. Like how we have female and male sports...

@TheDarkWaver The MnK community are asking for changes that will be of benefit to them. Some are even boldly saying that Aim assist should be completely removed on consoles as well. They clearly don't care about how changes will affect other communities and only want their preferences pushed forward. Sounds like catering to me.

Also the idea that Aim assists exists to balance between MnK and controllers is laughable. I don't know who said something so ridiculous but Aim assist existed when I played Goldeneye on the N64 and I don't believe there was crossplay then.

If Mnk is pushing for separate lobbies then I agree with that. I don't care so long as this is a MnK problem but I back the idea 100%.  However, MnK users should have no say in how controllers work.

Lastly I HATE how the AA feels in this game but the input device that does not need it should have no say.

@TheDarkWaver Unless you're arguing that Aim assist doesn't put MnK at a disadvantage it's impossible to say that ripping it out wouldn't be favorable to them. I'm not even debating whether aim assist is fair or not but that's a change that would CLEARLY be for the experience of MnK. Whether the change is fair/balanced/necessary or whatever it's still a change meant to benefit MnK. People seem to think that conceding a point means losing an argument but this is getting a little silly.

We do agree that lobbies should be separate though. I've hated the thought of crossplay since it was first mentioned and I'm still adamantly against it.

If Respawn actually wants Apex to be fair & balanced but will still not let MnK players turn crossplay off, they need to use data like this to tune AA for roller players.  That all assumes that this is valid data.

@TheDarkWaver After looking it up it seems I'm wrong. I've always used the word "benefit" to refer to which side something leans toward however it seems it means to give an advantage to or profit. I was lightly mocking MnK for focusing on their disadvantages while claiming a one-sided fix would make things equal. I don't believe things can be equal between the two inputs and even if the devs found a way I doubt both communities will agree things are fair.

Both inputs don't have strengths sans AA though. The one advantage controller has is Aim assist unless there's another I've taken for granted. Taking it away wouldn't make things "fair" it would just give MnK an undisputed advantage... which the Mnk community would call fair.

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@Zamaha400 wrote:

@TheDarkWaver After looking it up it seems I'm wrong. I've always used the word "benefit" to refer to which side something leans toward however it seems it means to give an advantage to or profit. I was lightly mocking MnK for focusing on their disadvantages while claiming a one-sided fix would make things equal. I don't believe things can be equal between the two inputs and even if the devs found a way I doubt both communities will agree things are fair.

Both inputs don't have strengths sans AA though. The one advantage controller has is Aim assist unless there's another I've taken for granted. Taking it away wouldn't make things "fair" it would just give MnK an undisputed advantage... which the Mnk community would call fair.

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Therefore splitting the 2 platforms is the best solution...