Request: Automatically register every guild member with zero damage when Raid starts

"Vertigo;881497" wrote:

"StarSon;881457" wrote:

"Vertigo;881447" wrote:

"SaltySkroob;881434" wrote:

"DarthBlartMC;881414" wrote:
Members need to participate in the actual raid in order to get prizes. Not a hard concept. It shouldn't be automatic, then people are rewarded for doing nothing. Put down your soccer trophies and think about it.

LoL, Zero damage period is the definition of participation trophy. Lets just formalize it and be done with it.

But if you weren't there to participate at all, you shouldn't get a participation trophy. If I'm on a soccer team, and we have a tournament, but I just don't show up I don't deserve any participation trophy because I did not participate. 1) I let down the team because I knew what time that tournament started, and 2) I didn't help at all, I didn't even sit on the bench the whole time cheering or anything, I was just not there. Say my soccer team wins and they are given trophies, do I get a trophy? No, I'm not there to receive it. 24hour 0 damage rule is fine, at least those people showed that they play fairly regularly, but like it's just not that hard to log in and register 0 damage... Theres no need to add this imo.

Your analogy only works if you consider that you paid to be on that soccer team, and without your payment no one would get to play. Everyone contributes tickets just by playing the game, and without that no one raids.

You are right about one thing though: doing a zero damage is easy. But why should we be forced to start a raid, disallow anyone from doing any actual damage for 24 hours, and then beat the raid in an hour? It's backwards. If you contribute tickets to the raid, you should get rewards.

It's not that I don't think it'd be helpful, I just don't think it'd be good for ALL guilds. This isn't a good thing for smaller guilds, its really only good for the ones that can beat it in an hour. For smaller guilds that don't finish the raids with as much ease as stronger guilds, this doesn't really encourage anyone to even show up and try. This in turn could lead to less participation in smaller less powerful guilds. That's the main thing I don't like about this, it doesn't really start guilds off in the right place with raids. If they were able to make it so that after you've completed Heroic once or X number of times then yeah, I'd be alright with that, just don't think it's a good policy for the entire spectrum of guilds.

On another note, it doesn't encourage everyone to go on their device and play the way that raids do now. CG wants people to have to log in and play to get stuff, so I feel like it's a little counter productive towards their gameplay system.

What? A guild that is struggling with heroic rancor won't complete the raid if its members don't participate. 0 damage doesn't change that. If you do 0 damage and your guild fails to kill rancor in 48 hours, you get nothing, just like the rest of your guild.

Anyway, this combines with general issues with guild management. Our guild just now reached the point where a 0dmg phase is needed, but we can't implement it properly because some people can't read chat... and we don't even really know who. The lack of guild management tools is the real issue here, but an automated 0dmg would solve it for this issue at least.

Maybe the devs could implement a grace period? Where if a raid finishes within say 2-3 hours all members of the guild get rewards? Then at least it keeps people who would've tried to contribute in the rewards but keeps people who weren't going to contribute from getting anything. Just a suggestion

"Acrofales;883213" wrote:

"Vertigo;881497" wrote:

"StarSon;881457" wrote:

"Vertigo;881447" wrote:

"SaltySkroob;881434" wrote:

"DarthBlartMC;881414" wrote:
Members need to participate in the actual raid in order to get prizes. Not a hard concept. It shouldn't be automatic, then people are rewarded for doing nothing. Put down your soccer trophies and think about it.

LoL, Zero damage period is the definition of participation trophy. Lets just formalize it and be done with it.

But if you weren't there to participate at all, you shouldn't get a participation trophy. If I'm on a soccer team, and we have a tournament, but I just don't show up I don't deserve any participation trophy because I did not participate. 1) I let down the team because I knew what time that tournament started, and 2) I didn't help at all, I didn't even sit on the bench the whole time cheering or anything, I was just not there. Say my soccer team wins and they are given trophies, do I get a trophy? No, I'm not there to receive it. 24hour 0 damage rule is fine, at least those people showed that they play fairly regularly, but like it's just not that hard to log in and register 0 damage... Theres no need to add this imo.

Your analogy only works if you consider that you paid to be on that soccer team, and without your payment no one would get to play. Everyone contributes tickets just by playing the game, and without that no one raids.

You are right about one thing though: doing a zero damage is easy. But why should we be forced to start a raid, disallow anyone from doing any actual damage for 24 hours, and then beat the raid in an hour? It's backwards. If you contribute tickets to the raid, you should get rewards.

It's not that I don't think it'd be helpful, I just don't think it'd be good for ALL guilds. This isn't a good thing for smaller guilds, its really only good for the ones that can beat it in an hour. For smaller guilds that don't finish the raids with as much ease as stronger guilds, this doesn't really encourage anyone to even show up and try. This in turn could lead to less participation in smaller less powerful guilds. That's the main thing I don't like about this, it doesn't really start guilds off in the right place with raids. If they were able to make it so that after you've completed Heroic once or X number of times then yeah, I'd be alright with that, just don't think it's a good policy for the entire spectrum of guilds.

On another note, it doesn't encourage everyone to go on their device and play the way that raids do now. CG wants people to have to log in and play to get stuff, so I feel like it's a little counter productive towards their gameplay system.

What? A guild that is struggling with heroic rancor won't complete the raid if its members don't participate. 0 damage doesn't change that. If you do 0 damage and your guild fails to kill rancor in 48 hours, you get nothing, just like the rest of your guild.

But putting 0 damage up automatically doesn't encourage people to fight in the raid if they're just going to end up with similar rewards. Putting 0 damage automatically encourages people in lower guilds to do less and just let some guys carry them without any effort and that's gonna lead to a loss in participation and if the few carrying most of the guild can't complete the whole thing, and the rest of the guild doesn't help the whole guild gets nothing, including the ones that tried to fight.

It's not entirely beneficial in the long run for low end guilds or start up guilds, and high tier guilds already have proven that they can regulate and organize well enough to do a 24 hour 0 damage period. It's not needed, it just makes the lives of the people at the top easier, and the lives of the people near the bottom worse.

"Vertigo;883207" wrote:

"Maljr1980;883201" wrote:

"DarthBlartMC;883199" wrote:
Don't you think it would effect participation of the raids if people got rewards and didn't have to show up?

I think if your guild is at a point where you have to have 24 hour no damage rules, then this is not an issue

But not all guilds are at that point, that's the problem. Like yeah this is great for guilds that can just run through heroic rancor raids in like half an hour, but the ones that struggle with it will see lazier people not helping and it will hurt the overall progress of the guild.

So if your guild can't finish the raid because some people don't take part, then they get no rewards anyway (along with the rest of the guild). It's pretty easy to see who is not taking part in the raid and to replace them.
It's a lot more work and effort to make it possible for 50 people to get in the leaderboard when the guild can finish the raid in a few minutes.

Either way requires some effort in guild management.

"kello_511;883236" wrote:

"Vertigo;883207" wrote:

"Maljr1980;883201" wrote:

"DarthBlartMC;883199" wrote:
Don't you think it would effect participation of the raids if people got rewards and didn't have to show up?

I think if your guild is at a point where you have to have 24 hour no damage rules, then this is not an issue

But not all guilds are at that point, that's the problem. Like yeah this is great for guilds that can just run through heroic rancor raids in like half an hour, but the ones that struggle with it will see lazier people not helping and it will hurt the overall progress of the guild.

So if your guild can't finish the raid because some people don't take part, then they get no rewards anyway (along with the rest of the guild). It's pretty easy to see who is not taking part in the raid and to replace them.
It's a lot more work and effort to make it possible for 50 people to get in the leaderboard when the guild can finish the raid in a few minutes.

Either way requires some effort in guild management.

But my point is, it just isn't that hard to get 50 people on the leaderboard when your guild can do the entire raid in 20 minutes. If your guild is that fast, they know exactly what theyre doing and they know to post 0 damage before hand. The weaker guilds get less activity in terms of recruitment and they are going to be the ones that get the short end of the stick here. I'm not saying this wouldn't be a nice thing for guilds that can complete the raids really quickly, I just don't think it will benefit all guilds. Maybe after your guild completes enough heroic raids, or theres some timer that you beat it in, they give the guild 0 damage no matter, what, but I believe that giving free 0 damage postings in weaker guild will encourage laziness and then encourage not participating or helping for free rewards.

Agree 100% with @Vertigo, also agree with @Acrofales, better guild management tools could help with any confusion in setting up 0 damage. Guild leaders should be shown what members are under age, and can not participate in chat. It's usually them who don't follow the rules, because they can't, and the guild leaders are left wondering who can and can not see chat.
Most of the problem here is that guilds full of 80+ level members are too strong for the Rancor raid. I think it is great that EA continues the Rancor Raid, but it is sorely in need of a higher tier and better rewards. But for now we need to work within the constraints and set the necessary limits so the most Han shards and rewards can get distributed to as many guild members as possible.
But making it easier to get rewards is not the way to go. It's silly. You should be asking for devs to make it harder.

"Vertigo;883246" wrote:

"kello_511;883236" wrote:

"Vertigo;883207" wrote:

"Maljr1980;883201" wrote:

"DarthBlartMC;883199" wrote:
Don't you think it would effect participation of the raids if people got rewards and didn't have to show up?

I think if your guild is at a point where you have to have 24 hour no damage rules, then this is not an issue

But not all guilds are at that point, that's the problem. Like yeah this is great for guilds that can just run through heroic rancor raids in like half an hour, but the ones that struggle with it will see lazier people not helping and it will hurt the overall progress of the guild.

So if your guild can't finish the raid because some people don't take part, then they get no rewards anyway (along with the rest of the guild). It's pretty easy to see who is not taking part in the raid and to replace them.
It's a lot more work and effort to make it possible for 50 people to get in the leaderboard when the guild can finish the raid in a few minutes.

Either way requires some effort in guild management.

But my point is, it just isn't that hard to get 50 people on the leaderboard when your guild can do the entire raid in 20 minutes. If your guild is that fast, they know exactly what theyre doing and they know to post 0 damage before hand. The weaker guilds get less activity in terms of recruitment and they are going to be the ones that get the short end of the stick here. I'm not saying this wouldn't be a nice thing for guilds that can complete the raids really quickly, I just don't think it will benefit all guilds. Maybe after your guild completes enough heroic raids, or theres some timer that you beat it in, they give the guild 0 damage no matter, what, but I believe that giving free 0 damage postings in weaker guild will encourage laziness and then encourage not participating or helping for free rewards.

I would be very surprised if there were any guilds doing a 0-damage phase who don't have someone mess up and post damage early on a regular basis. Either by getting the times mixed up, they could be pre-loading damage and accidentally release early, apparently it can even happen if your phone restarts in the middle of a run.

It seems like this is much more effort than looking at the board and seeing who hasn't hit the raid at all. The guilds that have this issue are the ones that need to be replacing those non-participants anyway. Just sitting back and struggling to finish your raid because "those guys won't get any rewards" doesn't help things any. Those guilds need to be actively managing their non-participating players and having the rewards awarded to both groups doesn't change that any.

Maybe the best solution would be for a toggle option that the guild leader can set for this.

I don't agree with this at all. Ranked rewards should be only for those who actively participated. If you're having trouble with guild members routinely not respecting the rules then perhaps you should reconsider their membership. And if 24 hours isn't enough time for someone to log in and register a 0 damage hit then that's on them.

If we must hand out rewards to everyone, I say add a default prize tier for those who didn't register a hit and have it basically only give out some credits and a few pieces of gear but no chance for a complete item and no Han/Kenobi shards.

"Vertigo;881497" wrote:

On another note, it doesn't encourage everyone to go on their device and play the way that raids do now. CG wants people to have to log in and play to get stuff, so I feel like it's a little counter productive towards their gameplay system.

This is the only reason that not doing it makes sense. Mobile games are all about time played, and this doesn't help that metric.

"phroxenphyre;883445" wrote:
And if 24 hours isn't enough time for someone to log in and register a 0 damage hit then that's on them.

The point isn't that 24 hours isn't enough. The point is that the 24 hours shouldn't be necessary. Everyone provided tickets to launch the raid. We shouldn't have to launch and say "nope, don't hit it guys, just send someone in to die because we'll kill this thing so fast it's the only way to make sure everyone gets rewards."