There just isn't any fun in this game anymore....

"HokieFiend;c-2160562" wrote:
I feel bad for this generation of gamers. It's sad that gaming has come to this. You don't deserve this. It's going to take a company with true creativity and vision to break the shackles. They've all lost sight of what's important. We need a Richard Garriott of mobile games to emerge.

All I can say is vote with your time and money. It's the only metrics that matter anymore.

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Also, it is more than likely that the people who are spending money on this game are from the older generation of gamers, not the newer one.

"Ryzak620;c-2160681" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Until the last 20 years, games were simply buy and play, and that's it. You paid $50.00 one time and had access to all of the content. And, the games back then were complete and, in general, less buggy.

Then the MMO came. You spent $50.00 to purchase the game, and then anywhere from $10-15 as a monthly fee. Other MMO's had a free subscription and you could get 95% of the content for nothing.

Now, we are at freemium games. Sure, you can play for free, but every company knows that there are a lot of 1) really competitive gamers that have to be the best at what they do, and/or 2) people that are OCD about collecting everything and not willing to wait for the trickle down. These companies bank on this and that's how they make their money. It's ingenious, bordering on exploitation. But it works. It worked on me on this game for 2-1/2 years, and now it works on me in another game. Fortunately, I can afford to pay to play. But there are many out there that can't and they can't control their spending either. That's not the fault of the makers of the games, but just like people addicted to MMO's back in the early 2000's, the next generation is going into massive debt due to the reasons stated above.

And while I've been out of this game for almost 2 years now, I have some friends that still play. They can't not play because of the time and money invested. That's why it took me 6 months to actually quit. I was really done with the game when the Revans came out. I knew then that any semblance of creating balance in this game was done, and was never going to improve. The company would just keep releasing ridiculously overpowered toons to counter the one released prior to it. The game I'm playing now is better, but the power creep is starting to set in, and I hope I will be able to stop playing when I realize the game has "jumped the shark."

There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's also no such thing as a free game. Every F2P person I know has at least spent $$ on something at least once, even if they consider themselves F2P.

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

"Kyno;c-2160688" wrote:

"Ryzak620;c-2160681" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Until the last 20 years, games were simply buy and play, and that's it. You paid $50.00 one time and had access to all of the content. And, the games back then were complete and, in general, less buggy.

Then the MMO came. You spent $50.00 to purchase the game, and then anywhere from $10-15 as a monthly fee. Other MMO's had a free subscription and you could get 95% of the content for nothing.

Now, we are at freemium games. Sure, you can play for free, but every company knows that there are a lot of 1) really competitive gamers that have to be the best at what they do, and/or 2) people that are OCD about collecting everything and not willing to wait for the trickle down. These companies bank on this and that's how they make their money. It's ingenious, bordering on exploitation. But it works. It worked on me on this game for 2-1/2 years, and now it works on me in another game. Fortunately, I can afford to pay to play. But there are many out there that can't and they can't control their spending either. That's not the fault of the makers of the games, but just like people addicted to MMO's back in the early 2000's, the next generation is going into massive debt due to the reasons stated above.

And while I've been out of this game for almost 2 years now, I have some friends that still play. They can't not play because of the time and money invested. That's why it took me 6 months to actually quit. I was really done with the game when the Revans came out. I knew then that any semblance of creating balance in this game was done, and was never going to improve. The company would just keep releasing ridiculously overpowered toons to counter the one released prior to it. The game I'm playing now is better, but the power creep is starting to set in, and I hope I will be able to stop playing when I realize the game has "jumped the shark."

There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's also no such thing as a free game. Every F2P person I know has at least spent $$ on something at least once, even if they consider themselves F2P.

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

So you're saying if CG doesn't take advantage of their weakness someone else probably will?

"Jakdnels;c-2160701" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160688" wrote:

"Ryzak620;c-2160681" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Until the last 20 years, games were simply buy and play, and that's it. You paid $50.00 one time and had access to all of the content. And, the games back then were complete and, in general, less buggy.

Then the MMO came. You spent $50.00 to purchase the game, and then anywhere from $10-15 as a monthly fee. Other MMO's had a free subscription and you could get 95% of the content for nothing.

Now, we are at freemium games. Sure, you can play for free, but every company knows that there are a lot of 1) really competitive gamers that have to be the best at what they do, and/or 2) people that are OCD about collecting everything and not willing to wait for the trickle down. These companies bank on this and that's how they make their money. It's ingenious, bordering on exploitation. But it works. It worked on me on this game for 2-1/2 years, and now it works on me in another game. Fortunately, I can afford to pay to play. But there are many out there that can't and they can't control their spending either. That's not the fault of the makers of the games, but just like people addicted to MMO's back in the early 2000's, the next generation is going into massive debt due to the reasons stated above.

And while I've been out of this game for almost 2 years now, I have some friends that still play. They can't not play because of the time and money invested. That's why it took me 6 months to actually quit. I was really done with the game when the Revans came out. I knew then that any semblance of creating balance in this game was done, and was never going to improve. The company would just keep releasing ridiculously overpowered toons to counter the one released prior to it. The game I'm playing now is better, but the power creep is starting to set in, and I hope I will be able to stop playing when I realize the game has "jumped the shark."

There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's also no such thing as a free game. Every F2P person I know has at least spent $$ on something at least once, even if they consider themselves F2P.

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

So you're saying if CG doesn't take advantage of their weakness someone else probably will?

Nope, I'm saying that people that make bad choices tend to make bad choices........ that goes for strong and weak people all over the world from all backgrounds of life. Trying to make a "aaww this poor person" argument as the general statement does work either, believe it or not, there are people who spend a lot of money on games and other things because they have the disposable income and it is no way a detriment to their life. Not knowing someone's lifestyle and not understanding that, doesnt not equate to them " taking advantage of a weakness"

"Kyno;c-2160706" wrote:

"Jakdnels;c-2160701" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160688" wrote:

"Ryzak620;c-2160681" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Until the last 20 years, games were simply buy and play, and that's it. You paid $50.00 one time and had access to all of the content. And, the games back then were complete and, in general, less buggy.

Then the MMO came. You spent $50.00 to purchase the game, and then anywhere from $10-15 as a monthly fee. Other MMO's had a free subscription and you could get 95% of the content for nothing.

Now, we are at freemium games. Sure, you can play for free, but every company knows that there are a lot of 1) really competitive gamers that have to be the best at what they do, and/or 2) people that are OCD about collecting everything and not willing to wait for the trickle down. These companies bank on this and that's how they make their money. It's ingenious, bordering on exploitation. But it works. It worked on me on this game for 2-1/2 years, and now it works on me in another game. Fortunately, I can afford to pay to play. But there are many out there that can't and they can't control their spending either. That's not the fault of the makers of the games, but just like people addicted to MMO's back in the early 2000's, the next generation is going into massive debt due to the reasons stated above.

And while I've been out of this game for almost 2 years now, I have some friends that still play. They can't not play because of the time and money invested. That's why it took me 6 months to actually quit. I was really done with the game when the Revans came out. I knew then that any semblance of creating balance in this game was done, and was never going to improve. The company would just keep releasing ridiculously overpowered toons to counter the one released prior to it. The game I'm playing now is better, but the power creep is starting to set in, and I hope I will be able to stop playing when I realize the game has "jumped the shark."

There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's also no such thing as a free game. Every F2P person I know has at least spent $$ on something at least once, even if they consider themselves F2P.

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

So you're saying if CG doesn't take advantage of their weakness someone else probably will?

Nope, I'm saying that people that make bad choices tend to make bad choices........ that goes for strong and weak people all over the world from all backgrounds of life. Trying to make a "aaww this poor person" argument as the general statement does work either, believe it or not, there are people who spend a lot of money on games and other things because they have the disposable income and it is no way a detriment to their life. Not knowing someone's lifestyle and not understanding that, doesnt not equate to them " taking advantage of a weakness"

I'm not talking about those people. I'm talking about the one's you say continually make bad choices and need regulations to protect them.

"Jakdnels;c-2160709" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160706" wrote:

"Jakdnels;c-2160701" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160688" wrote:

"Ryzak620;c-2160681" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Until the last 20 years, games were simply buy and play, and that's it. You paid $50.00 one time and had access to all of the content. And, the games back then were complete and, in general, less buggy.

Then the MMO came. You spent $50.00 to purchase the game, and then anywhere from $10-15 as a monthly fee. Other MMO's had a free subscription and you could get 95% of the content for nothing.

Now, we are at freemium games. Sure, you can play for free, but every company knows that there are a lot of 1) really competitive gamers that have to be the best at what they do, and/or 2) people that are OCD about collecting everything and not willing to wait for the trickle down. These companies bank on this and that's how they make their money. It's ingenious, bordering on exploitation. But it works. It worked on me on this game for 2-1/2 years, and now it works on me in another game. Fortunately, I can afford to pay to play. But there are many out there that can't and they can't control their spending either. That's not the fault of the makers of the games, but just like people addicted to MMO's back in the early 2000's, the next generation is going into massive debt due to the reasons stated above.

And while I've been out of this game for almost 2 years now, I have some friends that still play. They can't not play because of the time and money invested. That's why it took me 6 months to actually quit. I was really done with the game when the Revans came out. I knew then that any semblance of creating balance in this game was done, and was never going to improve. The company would just keep releasing ridiculously overpowered toons to counter the one released prior to it. The game I'm playing now is better, but the power creep is starting to set in, and I hope I will be able to stop playing when I realize the game has "jumped the shark."

There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's also no such thing as a free game. Every F2P person I know has at least spent $$ on something at least once, even if they consider themselves F2P.

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

So you're saying if CG doesn't take advantage of their weakness someone else probably will?

Nope, I'm saying that people that make bad choices tend to make bad choices........ that goes for strong and weak people all over the world from all backgrounds of life. Trying to make a "aaww this poor person" argument as the general statement does work either, believe it or not, there are people who spend a lot of money on games and other things because they have the disposable income and it is no way a detriment to their life. Not knowing someone's lifestyle and not understanding that, doesnt not equate to them " taking advantage of a weakness"

I'm not talking about those people. I'm talking about the one's you say continually make bad choices and need regulations to protect them.

And as I said, most likely people that make bad choices, will continue to do so. Regulations dont fix that, as I said.

"Kyno;c-2160711" wrote:

"Jakdnels;c-2160709" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160706" wrote:

"Jakdnels;c-2160701" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160688" wrote:

"Ryzak620;c-2160681" wrote:

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

Until the last 20 years, games were simply buy and play, and that's it. You paid $50.00 one time and had access to all of the content. And, the games back then were complete and, in general, less buggy.

Then the MMO came. You spent $50.00 to purchase the game, and then anywhere from $10-15 as a monthly fee. Other MMO's had a free subscription and you could get 95% of the content for nothing.

Now, we are at freemium games. Sure, you can play for free, but every company knows that there are a lot of 1) really competitive gamers that have to be the best at what they do, and/or 2) people that are OCD about collecting everything and not willing to wait for the trickle down. These companies bank on this and that's how they make their money. It's ingenious, bordering on exploitation. But it works. It worked on me on this game for 2-1/2 years, and now it works on me in another game. Fortunately, I can afford to pay to play. But there are many out there that can't and they can't control their spending either. That's not the fault of the makers of the games, but just like people addicted to MMO's back in the early 2000's, the next generation is going into massive debt due to the reasons stated above.

And while I've been out of this game for almost 2 years now, I have some friends that still play. They can't not play because of the time and money invested. That's why it took me 6 months to actually quit. I was really done with the game when the Revans came out. I knew then that any semblance of creating balance in this game was done, and was never going to improve. The company would just keep releasing ridiculously overpowered toons to counter the one released prior to it. The game I'm playing now is better, but the power creep is starting to set in, and I hope I will be able to stop playing when I realize the game has "jumped the shark."

There's no such thing as a free lunch. There's also no such thing as a free game. Every F2P person I know has at least spent $$ on something at least once, even if they consider themselves F2P.

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

So you're saying if CG doesn't take advantage of their weakness someone else probably will?

Nope, I'm saying that people that make bad choices tend to make bad choices........ that goes for strong and weak people all over the world from all backgrounds of life. Trying to make a "aaww this poor person" argument as the general statement does work either, believe it or not, there are people who spend a lot of money on games and other things because they have the disposable income and it is no way a detriment to their life. Not knowing someone's lifestyle and not understanding that, doesnt not equate to them " taking advantage of a weakness"

I'm not talking about those people. I'm talking about the one's you say continually make bad choices and need regulations to protect them.

And as I said, most likely people that make bad choices, will continue to do so. Regulations dont fix that, as I said.

That's what I'm trying to clarify. Then why:

"I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make"

If they are just going to make bad choices elsewhere?

"Kyno;c-2160688" wrote:

Then that's no f2p, and yes people do play this game absolutely 100% free.

So other than a slight reference to "other MMOs" you didnt event answer my question (or you kind of did), what caliber of games could you play for free before that you didnt pirate???

The answer is shocking, but here it goes, not so great ones. Sure they existed but they didnt have great graphics, or even a solid storyline, definitely no real IP attached to them. You have always had to pay to get a decent game.

Can I ask, do you feel the same way about other luxuries as you do about companies that use the freemium model? They offer things at a much higher price than they need to be, because people are willing to pay to have it, even when it's not any better or more functional than a counterpart. Those are also at fault for people going into debt they cant handle.

I agree regulations should be used to protect people from the bad choices they will make, but that just pushes them to make bad choices elsewhere, it doesnt actually solve the problem.

1. The MMO I was referring to, but forgot the name at that moment, was Guild Wars. I never played it, but I've read nothing but great things about it
2. You keep hinting at a storyline in GoH. What story line? It's a holotable. There's no continuation of raids or TB's. They are each just random entities added to the game. MSF (Marvel Strike Force) has a slight story line to it, and it evolves (very slowly), but most people don't really pay attention to it because it is so subtle and unnecessary. I'm not saying that GoH needs a story line, but one should not make an implication that it does.
3. You are correct that, yes, you definitely do have to pay for a game that has a story, good graphics, a good IP, etc.
4. I'm not sure what your implication about other luxuries that use the freemium model means. What are you trying to compare it to? Games that have the "loot boxes." Like Battlefront, etc.? If that's what you are referring to, then no, I don't play those, nor will I. If I pay $50-60 for a game, unless it's an MMO that has a subscription fee, I'm not going to continue to put more money into the game. If you are referring to something other than a game, then you need to be more specific
5. I 100% agree with your last statement about regulations. The entire www is in its "wild west" phase right now. Putting regulations on it would be no different than regulations like the FCC, FDA, etc. But, I also agree that people that are inclined to those kinds of poor choices will find another way to make those poor choices. For me, personally, once I'm done with MSF, I doubt there's much of a chance that there would be another freemium IP that would get me invested into it. I didn't get into the DC version of GoH, and I have yet to find a fantasy or sci-fi one that piques my interest.

$1000 for a character? Reasonable amount of time?

"Kyno;c-2160643" wrote:

"HokieFiend;c-2160562" wrote:
I feel bad for this generation of gamers. It's sad that gaming has come to this. You don't deserve this. It's going to take a company with true creativity and vision to break the shackles. They've all lost sight of what's important. We need a Richard Garriott of mobile games to emerge.

All I can say is vote with your time and money. It's the only metrics that matter anymore.

I'm not saying change shouldnt happen, but what caliber of games could you play for free back in the day, without pirating it?

None. The whole "free + microtransactions" concept for games is what is ruining gaming.