Bond with nature in this charming expansion pack means...

"ChocoSulSul;c-17901466" wrote:
Nobody buys a rhino but children will grow up with the idea that seeing an animal in a completely confined space is normal, when in reality animals were born to make the world theirs. Zoos, as you say, are needed only because of us. You cannot be the savior and the cause of the problem at the same time.

I couldn't agree more with this. As a kid I thought playing Zoo Tycoon was fun, now just the idea of the game, and what it teaches, repulses me. There are some nasty zoos where I live, where it's driven by profit with wild caught under fed animals. I agree this doesn't happen much in Europe or North America (although SeaWorld is another category). Before I started boycotting zoos, I've been to the one in San Diego, which was probably the most "free" zoo I've ever seen, but even then, the panda chewing on bamboo, be it in a giant glass cage, looked miserably out of place. Why is it that we have to imprison others for our entertainment?

"ChocoSulSul;c-17901466" wrote:
I remember in the sims 1 how animals were sold in a kind of shop window, at that time it seemed normal to me and not today. If I go back to the game out of nostalgia, I see that scene as a sad reality that continues to happen to us. Believe we have the right to sell a life as if it were an object... All I want is that what is contaminated in the real world is not in the world of the sims.

The Sims 1 and The Sims 2 had this, so disturbing:

Oh no, I totally forgot this used to be a thing in The Sims! I am so happy they changed their approach. I always adopt all my in game (and real life) companions off the street.

The idea of the animals just standing in those displays all day... You might say it doesn't happen in real life. But it does. In Thailand there's this market, where they sell dogs, cats, monkeys, and other animals just like this to this day. They are there in heat all day long just waiting for someone to choose them. It's all for profit and most often than not, the 'pedigrees' there have so many inbred diseases they don't make it many times. All while there are millions of street dogs around, starving and needing homes.

I think I am getting off topic, but the idea of zoos in the Sims is just too much to even consider. I don't think Maxis would go there, there'd be such a big backlash. Plus they are trying to be very progressive in their content.

The real life pet market:

I don't think zoos would work well in the sims, it would be like watching sims TV. It would be nice if they introduced more pets and wildlife you could befriend and pet, feed, build a shelter for or take to a vet if injured. Rabbits, foxes, deer, squirrels, raccoons, wolves, bears, wild cats, ducks, geese, otters, pigeons, owls, parrots in Sulani and Selvadorada, crows, etc. An active career as a forest ranger in a national park type neighbourhood and the possibility for sims who are not in the career to also have some input. Falconry would be also nice to have or a big parrot you could teach to talk if they decide to make a world inspired by Morocco or some pirate themed pack.

Zoo opinions


At any rate, I doubt we'll be getting a zoo pack anyway; that would require a ton of new models and animations, and even a decent habitat system would be very costly for the game with a shoestring budget and an aversion to making anything more complex than a toaster. But I'd love to see exotic animals put into the game on a smaller scale.

"ChocoSulSul;c-17901466" wrote:

"Gordy;c-17901458" wrote:
Zoos aren't inherently bad. They're key to the conservation and research of many species, bring awareness of animals and their plights to the general populace, and animals often thrive in zoos in ways they can't outside of them. There are bad zoos out there, but zoos as a whole have an important part in the animal kingdom, for people and animals.

Plus, zoo games have shown that taking care of animals and building up their habitats would be extremely fun gameplay. And The Sims would be awesome if we could have exotic pets. Yeah, it'd be illegal and immoral in real life, but no real animals would get hurt, it would be so freaking fun. I don't care if others get mad over it, I want my pet peafowl. It's not like the teenagers playing this game are going to go out and buy real pet rhinos, anyway.

That you feel entitled to conserve and investigate animals in real life speaks of how badly we behave as a species, animals would be better off with us far away, ceasing to monopolize their territories and contaminate them, they do not need humans to investigate them and if it is to save them They can only be saved from other humans ... Nobody buys a rhino but children will grow up with the idea that seeing an animal in a completely confined space is normal, when in reality animals were born to make the world theirs. Zoos, as you say, are needed only because of us. You cannot be the savior and the cause of the problem at the same time. I remember in the sims 1 how animals were sold in a kind of shop window, at that time it seemed normal to me and not today. If I go back to the game out of nostalgia, I see that scene as a sad reality that continues to happen to us. Believe we have the right to sell a life as if it were an object... All I want is that what is contaminated in the real world is not in the world of the sims.

I totally agree, well I'm not against zoos in real life as our current generations are trying to solve problems caused by our ancestors are our fellow people. But I think, creating National reserves and national parks are a better way to leave animals alone in their natural habitats. When I say National reserves and parks I mean it that way and not "safaris" as lots of people tend to think! Safaris are like zoos, they stress animals out and they're disturbing the natural system.
We need to create a space where humans don't go except rangers (cause they need to arrest poachers and such) and emergency services (when really needed).
Instead of zoos, a botanical garden with various species of carnivourous plants like the cowplant are being cultivated (like a I saw a dragonplant based on the model of the cowplant) that would be better. So yeah instead of zoos, maybe they should just bring more pets or just fantasy animals that can become pets if adopted (not bought, adopted)

> @ChocoSulSul said:
> That you feel entitled to conserve and investigate animals in real life speaks of how badly we behave as a species, animals would be better off with us far away, ceasing to monopolize their territories and contaminate them, they do not need humans to investigate them and if it is to save them They can only be saved from other humans ... Nobody buys a rhino but children will grow up with the idea that seeing an animal in a completely confined space is normal, when in reality animals were born to make the world theirs. Zoos, as you say, are needed only because of us. You cannot be the savior and the cause of the problem at the same time. I remember in the sims 1 how animals were sold in a kind of shop window, at that time it seemed normal to me and not today. If I go back to the game out of nostalgia, I see that scene as a sad reality that continues to happen to us. Believe we have the right to sell a life as if it were an object... All I want is that what is contaminated in the real world is not in the world of the sims.

Not necessarily! Yes, there are zoo's who do not exercise best practices, subjecting animals to abuse by locking them up without necessary cause. But there are also zoos who try to save animals by sheltering them.. Have you read the Elephant Whisperer by Lawrence Anthony? It's a truly beautiful book that I recommend, which showcases how animals may be saved from death by putting them in reserves (which in itself is quite a bigger form of a zoo, where the natural habitat is still present of course). I agree with you that normal zoos that keep healthy animals without initial cause, for the entertainment of people, is simply wrong. But animals that are on the verge of extinction and are unable to survive without human intervention in the wild, should totally be sheltered. And I would also understand that conservationism and education thereof is equally important. Are you playing the scientist career in the Sims 4? If so, we could argue it is unethical to play that career because scientists make use of lab rats, confining them to much smaller cages for educational and observational purposes. Anyway, there are some zoo's that make sure that the animals are healthy and well cared for and are eventually put back into their natural environment again. The only thing I'm totally against is keeping intelligent animals / mammals who were not injured or endangered into small containments, such as dolphins. Dolphins are truly one of the most intelligent animals and to keep such species in a small aquarium is unethical. Keeping animals for conservation and education purposes should only go to a certain extent where zoos should release the animals after a certain time-period..

@ElyssaX
Tell me why are they in danger of extinction?

> @ChocoSulSul said:
> @ElyssaX
> Tell me why are they in danger of extinction?

Human interference and change in climate. But that is also the reason why some humans aim to save these animals through sheltering them for the purposes of repopulation. Save the Elephants and Gorilla Doctors are two good examples of organisations that try to save specific animals for conservation and research purposes. Ethical zoos can additionally inspire people to make a connection with nature and research animals themselves. If someone would tell a group of persons that climate change threatens polar bears, maybe few would take action. But if this exact group of people would see a live polar bear at the zoo, perhaps more people would take action. Zoos can be an opportunity to get close to animals. After a day in the zoo, people may be more motivated to take action, especially if they are confronted with documentaries or news outlines that capture the ongoing extinction of the animals they saw and loved at the zoo. Zoos also participate in species reintroduction programmes so that exotic animals who have been captive-bred, will survive in the wild without any human intervention.

Thus, it is important to distinguish ethical zoos from non-ethical zoos. But to go back to the key question here, whether I would love to have zoos in the sims 4? Yes. I have loved going to the local zoo here in the past. It has inspired me to research animals and in the end to contribute to a wildlife organisation. If the Sims 4 could incorporate zoos in a way that makes the sims help and care for animals or research them, I would definitely love that.

Isn't gardening still bugged? I mean, I'd love a countryside/farming pack, but if it were about farming, I think they would prioritize fixing gardening first. :(

I honestly have no idea what this could mean... Even though I'm hoping horses return, and seeing some kind of farming would be nice (with cows and sheep and chickens and ducks etc.), the amount of times we as a community have been: "new pack! I bet it's !" is so high at this point that I just kind of expect to be disappointed now, which is sad... So my expectations are extremely low.

Also, if they bring in fairies, I 99% believe they won't even be a new occult/life state, and will just be a new version of the spirits from SE/ghosts from Paranormal. Can't have new systems in this game without making sure they can be repackaged over and over again with new coats of paint.

Also, if this new EP is tied into any base game updates/overhauls, which it most likely will be as we're gonna be getting a few of them, then I'm trying to figure out what new game systems could both fit into a "charming" new EP but also be integrated in some way into the base game. And I really am just not sure what to think about all of this... I guess farming could? Especially since for a lot of people gardening is broken atm, and we haven't seen them make any strides to fix it. So maybe we can expect a gardening overhaul? But I really don't know what to expect. I just know to keep my expectations very low... Then I can get excited if my true expectations are met haha.

I would love to see farms/horses, and they could implement the hiking system into a horse trail system where there are trails around the world you can travel on in groups while riding horses, and there can be a few different trails of differing difficulties or sights to see. And you could find little groups of fairies out in the world on your ride, who if you befriend could like help you out on your farm or something like level up/harvest plants maybe. Cuz like I said, if we get fairies, I really am not expecting them to be a new life state unfortunately (unless they do something that's like... Your sim can be a fairy but there are other "lesser" fairies out in the world? I really do just expect them to repackage SE spirits though...).

Hoping for the best! Expecting disappointment... ?

Of course there are many other charming ways to bond with nature but I don’t think they’d dedicate an entire EP to that...?