There is no way to pellets from the mastiff that are not headshots should score 112 damage yet anything short stream close range the massive is completely useless it should be balanced so it is average at medium range rather than being overpowered at close range and then utterly useless at anything further

@LordloshBang And I'm pointing out that the R99 is more OP than the Mastiff. Watch the video back taking note of the R99 damage etc, its toxic.The R99 shouldn't be doing AR damage at medium range, its an smg.The Mastiff is good imo, maybe a bit too good but you have to be close or your getting very inconsistent damage.

@LordloshBang Well you've proven that the Mastiff is effective at a greater range than a shotgun should have. That holds very little meaning in a game where a wingman beats snipers at long range and a smg (R-99) is used as a high rate of fire assault rifle.Even when those 50 damage shots landed the rate of fire was too low to compete with anything. It's a surprisingly high number but a joke in comparison to any gun in the game that isn't a shotgun.If you want to compare the shotguns then isn't the Eva-8 a low skill spamming shotgun while the Mastiff takes SOME skill to use effectively? In the first video you see the player bobbing,weaving, and sliding while using the R-99 but he stands perfectly still 90% of the time he uses the Mastiff. Seems to imply that he can't land those shots on the move like he can with any other weapon.

@LordloshBang 50 meters? 50 damage? Get me a clip of you doing that while in an actual fight! That’s an impressive feat. I don’t see people using it at that distance often.70-80 isn’t all that much, especially since top tier auto weapons can destroy you fairly easily.The PK had a consistent spread that was easy to use. Line the enemy up within the box and fire for fairly good damage.Sure with the Mastiff you can hit things easier, but that doesn’t translate to damage. I could hip-fire with the Mastiff and get a hit every time, but the damage would be extremely low. To actually get good damage with the Mastiff, you have to line the enemy up with the actual center of the spread, (it’s easier with iron sights), in order to deal good damage. If you don’t do it correctly, you’ll end up with only some of the bullets hitting and like 40 damage. In effect, the Mastiff has a wider spread, which allows you to hit things easier, but to get actual damage you have to ads and the spread becomes much more difficult to hit.Except for if you have an basic Evo shield or no shield, the Mastiff doesn’t one shot you. It’s more of a 2-3 shot if they’re really close. If that’s too much, then don’t get that close and don’t let them get that close.

@LordloshBang Those distances really aren’t that far. 40 damage per shot isn’t really enough, mainly because something like the R-99 will kill faster at that range.These ranges really aren’t that far away, definitely not 50 meters in most cases. These are still fairly close.Besides, if you want the shotguns to not be viable at all at that range, at what range would you prefer them to be viable? Extremely close range? If the shotguns require you to be super close, then people won’t use them as much, since guns like the R-301 just have more versatility in every scenario.The range of the pellets isn’t that big.In the 2:00 clip, it seems like the Loba isn’t behind the door at all, but it’s a little hard to tell. I think at the moment he fired, she was halfway, but once the pellets traveled, she was outside. Also, that’s not a big distance. It’s not even mid range.2:55 clip, yeah, kind of. That’s really not that far. Do you want it to be even closer range than that?5.04 clip, that’s literally actual close range. Should the shotgun not dominate in that close of a range?You do have to aim with it.

@LordloshBang That range was definitely not 50 meters, nor should a shotgun do less than 20 damage at 20-25 meters (or less. Any more would be kind of weird, which is why they swapped the PK with the Mastiff. You might get lucky and get some damage at 30, but definitely not 50). That would destroy shotguns as an entire category.Most of those ranges in the clips you showed were pretty close ranges. Especially in the 5:04 clip, where they were in the same room, probably not even 10 meters apart.

Mastiff too powerful at close range

49 Replies

Sir_Named
5 years ago
@Hilshire12 The PK was average at mid-range, one of the reasons by they did the swap.
The Mastiff isn’t even as good at close range as the PK.
LordloshBang
5 years ago
I disagree. Mastiff is too easy to hit the target, unlike PK. With PK you actually needed a bit skill, but PK was OP too.
The best with a full hit(all the pellets) should do no more than 70 damage.
Shootgun should be a finishing weapon, not like now, a game changer. Its rewarding the low tier player base that simply spam with it.
So many games i died to a Mastiff, where the enemy could not even land a shot on me with his AR/SMG, and he 2 shoot me with a Mastiff, like he is some kind of a god ...
Sir_Named
5 years ago
@LordloshBang The PK could be hip-fired, and it’s spread made it easy to deal large amounts of damage. (The star spread. If you get the person in there, you deal sizable damage.)
The Mastiff has to be ADS, and because of it’s horizontal spread, you can really only get like 70-80 damage per shot, (unless it’s like point blank, but that would kind of be your fault. It you let the enemy get that close, you just got outplayed.)
LordloshBang
5 years ago
I can easily get 52 damage from a like 50 meter distance, which is crazy, because of its a shootgun.
Plenty of people are using it at that distance to finish opponents off.
70-80 damage its still too much, because you are not landing all of your shots, yet you get insane damage in exchange. And the damage its even more to LP. :D
Being able to kill someone with 2 shots with a bad aim, shot not be allowed.
With PK the chance to miss is greater, its spread its not as big as the mastiff.
With mastiff even if you spam you still hit for 30-40+ damage.
Eva8 for example has s***** range from anything less further than close range.
Again shootgun should not be able to one shot you. At up close, Mastiff on the body is doing like 126 damage. It can 1 shoot you even with an Evo Shield ....

Its the only weapon i currently hate and think its OP.
Sir_Named
5 years ago
@LordloshBang 50 meters? 50 damage? Get me a clip of you doing that while in an actual fight! That’s an impressive feat. I don’t see people using it at that distance often.
70-80 isn’t all that much, especially since top tier auto weapons can destroy you fairly easily.

The PK had a consistent spread that was easy to use. Line the enemy up within the box and fire for fairly good damage.
Sure with the Mastiff you can hit things easier, but that doesn’t translate to damage. I could hip-fire with the Mastiff and get a hit every time, but the damage would be extremely low. To actually get good damage with the Mastiff, you have to line the enemy up with the actual center of the spread, (it’s easier with iron sights), in order to deal good damage. If you don’t do it correctly, you’ll end up with only some of the bullets hitting and like 40 damage. In effect, the Mastiff has a wider spread, which allows you to hit things easier, but to get actual damage you have to ads and the spread becomes much more difficult to hit.

Except for if you have an basic Evo shield or no shield, the Mastiff doesn’t one shot you. It’s more of a 2-3 shot if they’re really close. If that’s too much, then don’t get that close and don’t let them get that close.
LordloshBang
5 years ago
I don`t record my game, so its hard to give you a clip. And i don`t play shootgun and Mastiff esp. much.
But you can always try it at the firing range. D:

But i watch a lot of pro streamers and a some of them are using it for exactly that. Got to find the game with Hal where he was shooting from a range with Mastiff one of the players and him him with 52 damage from a huge distance.
But yeah Mastiff is doing too much damage in close range and too much of a damage in kinda let said it SMG/medium range.
Its not the exact videos i was watching with Hal, but this is a good example too:
Look at 3:99:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ0cDmetq_s
Also 3:32, in the same video. Should you be able to still do such a damage on such distance ?
Same video, 6:08 he hit for 39 with half of his shots actually hit the target for a big distance. He literally finish all of them from a long range with the Mastiff.
Try to do this with Eva8 all you will got will be 8 damage at best if you manage to even hit them ....

The other problem with the mastiff is that is the best weapon for downed enemy,. you one shoot them ....
In this video at 4:01, he is doing 55, 66, 55 damage to Gibralter(he got fortified) in a SMG range situation, where shootgun damage should not be that massive.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qcbjMNMMqU
Esp when it shoot that fast.
sgruzz
5 years ago
@Sir_Namedgot oneshot many times even with Evo purple...I believe there is a bug where the Mastiff ignores the armor.
Sir_Named
5 years ago
@LordloshBang First thing, 3:99 is not a valid time signature. I was confused for a second.
After reviewing that TSM guy’s clip, he got the best shot, but that was also not 50 meters. Also, his R-99 recoil control is suspiciously good.
The 3:32 clip is fine. It takes multiple shots, and it is more like 15 meters. Definitely not 50.
The 6:08 clip also proves my point. He had to take two shots, both of which did less than 40 damage. If he had some other auto weapon, it’d be much better.
Yes, a close range shotgun is good for killing a close, mostly defenseless person.

On the other video, the Gibby clip is a good example, but there are some counter points I can make.
The Gibby was surprised, and therefore didn’t put up his gunshield, which put him at a huge disadvantage given his thicc body.

A lot of those clips had people fairly close, maybe 10 meters away, and the Mastiff just did around 50 damage a shot. Not nearly as close to the amount of damage it could do if closer.

Also, I wouldn’t section off a certain range as SMG range only in this kind of scenario. The SMG’s can really be used from 5 meters out to much further (if you have pro aim. Mediocre aim still works, depending on the smg.), and similarly, the shotguns can be used from point blank to 15 meters effectively.
Sir_Named
5 years ago
@sgruzz That’s strange. Even if they did a full headshot, it doesn’t do 200 damage.
Maybe you were hit with something else at the same time? Or like a millisecond before?
Xx__Miku831__xX
5 years ago
@Sir_Named I think he means the 3:59 clip, which I think that distance is about 30+ meters. I wonder why he can land 4+ bullets at that distance, despite that it seems that only 1-2 bullets hit on the screen.