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AymCTL's avatar
AymCTL
Seasoned Ace
2 years ago
Solved

Are you sure there are no level modifiers?

This is my third season, and I still am yet to have any games with as much success as I had last season, even though I have won more games this season.

I have noticed I'll have a string of like several games in a row where people just can't kill me and I can down them pretty fast.  Then I'll go back to having games where I can put three clips into people and hardly do any damage and they can kill me in like 1 to 3 hits easily, even with guns that normally don't do that much damage.

It seems to me that the matchmaking will put you in with more experienced players when you are successful, who can finish you off while hitting you fewer times. 

This leads me to believe there must be some kind of stat modification given to players based on their level for things like health, defense, and speed.  This is because it seems this would have to be the case unless most of these players in these lobbies are cheating, especially since none of what they do is skill related and is more related to the behavior of the game.  Like the same shot doing different damage to different people, people taking more or less damage when receiving the same shots, and some players moving faster than others in ways that isn't skill related (like 2 players sprinting side by side with no gun drawn and one moves faster).

I know most THINK the game has no modifiers the way an rpg game does, but is there any way to check and make sure from someone that would be "in the know" on that in an official capacity?  

  • @AymCTL 

    That is a great reply. You are not barking up the wrong tree, you are doing better because you are playing smarter.

    Here is something to think about, for the very competitive minded: if you place second all that is is first loser. "There can only be One" 

    Yeah those great games where you get like 8-10 kills and place top 5 or better are rare and the thing that counts is consistency. 

    I am also not getting those high kill count games as often as before but I have a top 5 placement percentage of about 42%, My win rate is great, I more than doubled the wins I had last season and I have more kills then I have ever had. 

    The numbers do not lie however the feel, pace and adrenaline of the game my be a bit different because gamers evolve and want to win.

    There is a somewhat correlation between wins and kills for most casual gamers: if you are winning more your high kill games go down (your avg may go up), if you are having high kill games your top 5/wins % goes down. 

    Basically either play smarter to win, or you push until the gas runs out. 

9 Replies

  • @AymCTL Hey there, sadly match making is a mechanic they have not released to the public on what factors its matchings. So we wont know for sure only assumptions based on experience.Which i completely understand since it would allow people to try and manipulate the system tanking stats to play against lesser skilled users. 

    Match making and how its done for most games is a hidden secret since its one of the most important factors with the game.

  • @AymCTL 

    Here is a good question for you, what is successes in Apex? 

    You wrote "and I still am yet to have any games with as much success as I had last season, even though I have won more games this season."

    The Goal of the BR in Apex is to win right?

    With that thought in mind "I have won more games this season" that would equal a greater success, right?

    The game does not give players buffs or mods for taking  or doing more damage or other things based off of level "(like 2 players sprinting side by side with no gun drawn and one moves faster)" That is absolutely ridiculous and false. 


  • @AymCTL wrote:

    This is my third season, and I still am yet to have any games with as much success as I had last season, even though I have won more games this season.

    I have noticed I'll have a string of like several games in a row where people just can't kill me and I can down them pretty fast.  Then I'll go back to having games where I can put three clips into people and hardly do any damage and they can kill me in like 1 to 3 hits easily, even with guns that normally don't do that much damage.

    It seems to me that the matchmaking will put you in with more experienced players when you are successful, who can finish you off while hitting you fewer times. 

    This leads me to believe there must be some kind of stat modification given to players based on their level for things like health, defense, and speed.  This is because it seems this would have to be the case unless most of these players in these lobbies are cheating, especially since none of what they do is skill related and is more related to the behavior of the game.  Like the same shot doing different damage to different people, people taking more or less damage when receiving the same shots, and some players moving faster than others in ways that isn't skill related (like 2 players sprinting side by side with no gun drawn and one moves faster).

    I know most THINK the game has no modifiers the way an rpg game does, but is there any way to check and make sure from someone that would be "in the know" on that in an official capacity?  


    Yes yes yes yes yes!!! ALL OF THIS!!!@!!!!!

    Go play some games, I slightly tickle fully purple shields with a car and erase a whole squad like a hot knife through butter.

    Then I'll start having games where I empty 3 full magazines into an opponent and they just don't ever die...

    YET... I'll be hit with 3 bullets from ANY gun... and be downed immediately.

    This wild and dramatic opposites of inconsistency raises massive questions about this game. 

    And I find it's very peculiar how it only ever seem to happen with EA games. Had this in Battlefront - was getting 40 deathmatch kills a game to suddenly emptying a whole 20 odd shots in an opponents head for them to turn around and kill me with 2.

    Is 'dynamic difficulty adjustment' something we are permitted to discuss here? As it would seem to potentially explain such gameplay experiences 

    Either way it makes the game very very very unenjoyable.

  • AymCTL's avatar
    AymCTL
    Seasoned Ace
    2 years ago
    @Asmodeus566 What Asmodeus566 says here is something to think about. What is success? I may "feel" like I'm not playing better and I am making fewer kills, but number do not lie. My kdr is higher, my win rate percentage is much higher, damage is higher than the previous two seasons combined, and I have won more games this season than last season. The only thing lower is the amount of kills that I do per match, instead of killing 7 or 8 players per match it is now more like 1 or 2 with some knocks and assists.

    So, does this just mean I'm now playing smarter rather than just running around making kills? After all, the object to the game is to win and not necessarily to make kills. I mean, could I be barking up the wrong tree here and really I'm doing how I should be doing since the numbers show that I am, and could this mean that my frustration is more from facing higher skilled players with more wins than it is not making enough kills?

    It's weird because I don't "feel" like I'm playing as good even though the numbers say that I am. I guess having that 3 week streak toward the end of last season ruined me because now I always expect to play like that, and when I don't it feels like something is wrong.
  • AymCTL's avatar
    AymCTL
    Seasoned Ace
    2 years ago
    @1ronKeys Yes, what you describe here is exactly what I'm talking about. What you describe here with the car is the same way I was with the havoc, I'd play games where I'd take people out in a split second, then this season starts and the havoc barely breaks their shields and I am seemingly taking more damage going down with very few hits.

    Also, what is "dynamic difficulty adjustment?" Does that mean that difficulty adjustments come at different times like when someone has a win streak or starts playing better? I mean, like a sudden jump in difficulty rather than gradual?
  • Asmodeus566's avatar
    Asmodeus566
    Hero+
    2 years ago

    @AymCTL 

    That is a great reply. You are not barking up the wrong tree, you are doing better because you are playing smarter.

    Here is something to think about, for the very competitive minded: if you place second all that is is first loser. "There can only be One" 

    Yeah those great games where you get like 8-10 kills and place top 5 or better are rare and the thing that counts is consistency. 

    I am also not getting those high kill count games as often as before but I have a top 5 placement percentage of about 42%, My win rate is great, I more than doubled the wins I had last season and I have more kills then I have ever had. 

    The numbers do not lie however the feel, pace and adrenaline of the game my be a bit different because gamers evolve and want to win.

    There is a somewhat correlation between wins and kills for most casual gamers: if you are winning more your high kill games go down (your avg may go up), if you are having high kill games your top 5/wins % goes down. 

    Basically either play smarter to win, or you push until the gas runs out. 

  • RockDokRock's avatar
    RockDokRock
    Seasoned Ace
    2 years ago

    @AymCTL wrote:
    @1ronKeysYes, what you describe here is exactly what I'm talking about. What you describe here with the car is the same way I was with the havoc, I'd play games where I'd take people out in a split second, then this season starts and the havoc barely breaks their shields and I am seemingly taking more damage going down with very few hits.

    Also, what is "dynamic difficulty adjustment?" Does that mean that difficulty adjustments come at different times like when someone has a win streak or starts playing better? I mean, like a sudden jump in difficulty rather than gradual?

    Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment is the concept that the game can get harder/easier mid game.  EA has a patent on this so there are plenty of conspiracy theories around that games are "rigged" or (in the case of the FIFA Community) "scripted".  I don't buy that for a second.  DDA is clearly used for modes where it is you against the computer and will adjust the difficulty as you go along which makes sense.  In a player vs player environment this would not be employed regardless of all the conspiracy theories out there.

  • 1ronKeys's avatar
    1ronKeys
    2 years ago

    @RockDokRock wrote:

    @AymCTL wrote:
    @1ronKeysYes, what you describe here is exactly what I'm talking about. What you describe here with the car is the same way I was with the havoc, I'd play games where I'd take people out in a split second, then this season starts and the havoc barely breaks their shields and I am seemingly taking more damage going down with very few hits.

    Also, what is "dynamic difficulty adjustment?" Does that mean that difficulty adjustments come at different times like when someone has a win streak or starts playing better? I mean, like a sudden jump in difficulty rather than gradual?

    Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment is the concept that the game can get harder/easier mid game.  EA has a patent on this so there are plenty of conspiracy theories around that games are "rigged" or (in the case of the FIFA Community) "scripted".  I don't buy that for a second.  DDA is clearly used for modes where it is you against the computer and will adjust the difficulty as you go along which makes sense.  In a player vs player environment this would not be employed regardless of all the conspiracy theories out there.


    I mean, I sont want to get involved in the chatter around this. But plenty have experienced incredibly peculiar game behaviour which is repeatable and demonstrable for many players (such as described in the OP).

    In FIFA for example, you will see your players unable to move and be outpaced by much slower opposition players, and miss 5 open goals in a row.

    In things like Apex people experience it taking more (or less) damage to eliminate a player.

    Also... regarding DDA only being about vs cpu - pretty sure there was a historic Madden commercial which showed a dad playing his daughter and it saying how the game adapts to make gameplay balance out so its fair or fun for all.

    Now the fact that EA patented this shows its more than mere 'conspiracy', but perhaps because this code exists in its games .. maybe there's the chance that this inadvertently slipped into pVp modes?

    In FIFA they introduced 'mystery ball' which showed by exagerration players getting boosted during game. --- very very peculiar introduction.

    However. If code like this exists in games, potentially it can inadvertently effect pvp ???

    What is the likelihood and possibility of that ??

    Or you could put it down to Internet connection... but why do people connections fluctuate quite night and day between instant kills and endless damage? 

    People just want fairness and consistency 

    I've frequently been 2 shot killed by a havoc or such for example 

  • EA_Mako's avatar
    EA_Mako
    Icon for Community Manager rankCommunity Manager
    2 years ago

    Hey folks, just going to nip this one in the bud right here.

    Claims of any sort of Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment (DDA) in Apex are as false here as they are in FC24, the earlier FIFA titles, or our other games.

    This is absolutely not something that's being used in Apex. 

    Locking the thread here to avoid spreading false information further, thank you.


    "We would not use DDA technology to give players an advantage or disadvantage in online multiplayer modes in any of our games..."

    Fair Play & Dynamic Difficulty Adjustment (ea.com)