"CG_SBCrumb;d-253661" wrote:
WHAT’S THE META WITH YOU?
There has been a bunch of great discussion in the community around balance and speculation around potential changes to units in the game. While there will always be these kinds of questions and concerns, our goal is to be as transparent as possible on when and why we make these changes. To that end, we want to provide some broader understanding on when and why we intervene to change characters that are significantly not performing as expected. Of course, changing a character after launch is something we want to avoid at all costs and is always a last resort but sometimes becomes necessary.
To get everyone on the same page, let’s begin with how all the different types of units fit together and lay out the current hierarchy of power. To be clear, this certainly does not hold universally true for all units but is a rough rubric we can use to discuss this topic in more detail. There are many exceptions to the rules (in the name of fun and interesting gameplay) that exist but overall this is a good snapshot of how we approach power.
Star Wars Galaxy of Heroes Power Tiers:
- Marquee/Galactic Chase - ex. Second Sister, Iden Versio
- Journey Guide, Conquest Units - ex. Jedi Knight Revan, Commander Luke Skywalker
- Galactic Legends - ex. Supreme Leader Kylo Ren, Rey
- Galactic Legends with Conquest Counterpart - ex. Jedi Master Kenobi with Commander Ahsoka Tano
NOTE: This list assumes squad compositions are highly synergistic and have comparable mods. This may not always be the case in practice and, if so, is not a balance issue. For example, a Galactic Legend with weak mods and in a non-ideal squad may potentially be challenged by a well modded and highly synergistic squad from the lower tiers.
Wait! Why is there no mention of Omicroned units in the above list? Omicrons boost the power of a unit. Adding an Omicron will move a unit up around a tier on the scale above, which means their final power varies based on the type of character. So where do they sit on the power scale? Marquee units with Omicrons get lifted up to somewhere between the level of a Journey Guide or Conquest unit, while a character like Starkiller (Journey Guide) or Boba Fett, Scion of Jango (Conquest) can rival a Galactic Legend in their specific mode with the right squad.
It is important to note that when we talk about counters to a squad, there are a ton of elements that need to be considered. The intent is that a counter to a squad should be roughly comparable in effort to unlock but there are a ton of factors to what is “comparable”.
When we investigate a balance issue, team composition, mods, abilities/ultimates/gear/relic levels and the consistency of the counter all play a role in the final decision. We examine a number of different squad variations and we review the data of how all players mod these squads in order to get the best snapshot of the current balance players are experiencing but the most effective squads with close to equal modding have the most weight in our decisions. On top of that, the win rate and reliability of these matchup are also important factors. A consistent counter is more likely to see changes than one than is only sometimes possible.
We also consider how to address those issues while supporting a healthy amount of theorycrafting. It is important to strike a balance between encouraging creative uses for units and keeping the value of progressing to higher units intact. And there are a ton of other factors that modify this balance: Omicron vs not-omicron, stronger mods vs weaker mods, challenging a squad’s less than ideal comp, does this squad encourage under gearing or leveling abilities, and more.
...
To reiterate, not every unit is going to fall nicely into these constraints and we may release units that push the limits of these boundaries in the name of interesting gameplay but I hope this provides some context for where future characters will land and where we may intervene for balance.
As always, the team is committed to announcing any changes to units as early as possible and sharing the context for why the changes are necessary whenever we can. Omicrons, reworked game modes, and Conquest Units have shifted the “meta” and the focus of many rosters, but our goals continue to be a long healthy life to the game, transparency around upcoming changes, and most important of all, fun and diverse experience when playing with your collection of Star Wars characters and ships.
"subxsimo;c-2422407" wrote:
I think there are two main issues which are being highlighted
1. The whole point of gls being introduced if I'm not mistaken was to prevent mirror and repetitive matches
"subxsimo;c-2422297" wrote:
Reva should be heavily nerfed because what cg is saying is Reva is stronger than Luke, anakin, sidious, revan, maul the list goes on
"MaruMaru;c-2425536" wrote:"Dace_Prow;c-2425529" wrote:"Ultra;c-2422340" wrote:
Imagine, as a player, asking her to be nerfed so that once you unlock and dump 700 kyros she's just meh since she counters like 2 GLs after nerf because that is more fair to you as someone who owns her
like which GL doesn't have more than 1 non-GL counter at this point? What's adding one more?
JMK. Only non-GL counter currently is reva.
https://swgoh.gg/gac/counters/JEDIMASTERKENOBI/?exclude_gl&season=38&d_unit=PADMEAMIDALA&d_unit=GENERALKENOBI
(GI when his datacron rolls around can also beat JMK but its very iffy) .... without it 3% win rate
If you remove the cut-off, you'll see various dr. aphra comps has a decent chance (%50 region)
"BubbaFett;c-2422251" wrote:
Not sure where you sit in GAC @CrispyFett But I can tell you in kyber that a "guy with th emost GL's wins" system is not for me...
"CrispyFett;c-2422255" wrote:"BubbaFett;c-2422250" wrote:"CrispyFett;c-2422249" wrote:"BubbaFett;c-2422240" wrote:
SEE comps, JMK comps and even Traya comps can counter Reva.....
but shouldn't she not be able to kill any GL? isn't that the CG way? I'm excluding datacrons, because they are temporary (per CG anyway)
It would be a really boring gam eif nothing could kill a GL....
for the most part, most of the counters are other GL (barring datacrons), no? yes there are exceptions, but im talking the majority of counters?
"MaruMaru;c-2422306" wrote:"BubbaFett;c-2422280" wrote:"MaruMaru;c-2422278" wrote:"BubbaFett;c-2422277" wrote:"MaruMaru;c-2422276" wrote:
But yea, be my guest pretend playing as if investment viewpoint justifies the current reva power level. Then change your tune once cg cuts to toon to a lower size. No surprises there xD
Why shouldn't Reva beat GL?..... She certainly requires a lot more investment...
I didn't say she shouldn't beat a gl. This is not a boolean equation of "beat a gl y/n."
Maybe not, but it is the topic of the thread and the original post.....
If you aren't concerned about Reva beating GL then what exactly are you concerned about?
There are degrees of things. Like I said it's not "does this thing beat a gl?". I have all the gl and I'll soon have her unlocked. I still don't like the severity of power shift. Do you have first hand experience playing with or against her?
In short power creep begets power creep. Power has always crept as this is the nature of this type of games. This particular creep is too much creep in my experience so far.
