Winning with the entire team specified

So are you saying they aren't directly linking a large amount of feats to new characters?

You also missed out the nightsister feats. Regardless of which, by both of our admission you can cheese some feats. However that's not the design surely you can see that? CG don't make these feats with the intention of us being able to cheese them.

Just to throw out the stats for some of these characters for the benefit of some end game players that don't quite get how difficult it's getting for the rest of the community to play conquest when it comes to these feats

According to swgoh.gg: (at gear 13)
1% of the overall playerbase has Captain Rex
3% have characters like cere, cal, merrin, tarful
3% newest tuskens
6% have aphra requirements
15% have inquisitors
10% have hera at relics but 1% has chopper

So to suggest that achieving red crate isn't aimed for endgame players is laughable. Again I have no complaints about this but firstly recognise the reality and secondly while your looking how to cheese a few feats to get red crate, the majority of players are counting key cards to ensure we can get gold, which is becoming harder.

I guess most players should just accept that they have to wait for new things instead expecting to get them the first time around if they dont want to spend money.

"Arrowsmith23;c-2430397" wrote:
So are you saying they aren't directly linking a large amount of feats to new characters?

You also missed out the nightsister feats. Regardless of which, by both of our admission you can cheese some feats. However that's not the design surely you can see that? CG don't make these feats with the intention of us being able to cheese them.

Just to throw out the stats for some of these characters for the benefit of some end game players that don't quite get how difficult it's getting for the rest of the community to play conquest when it comes to these feats

According to swgoh.gg: (at gear 13)
1% of the overall playerbase has Captain Rex
3% have characters like cere, cal, merrin, tarful
3% newest tuskens
6% have aphra requirements
15% have inquisitors
10% have hera at relics but 1% has chopper

So to suggest that achieving red crate isn't aimed for endgame players is laughable. Again I have no complaints about this but firstly recognise the reality and secondly while your looking how to cheese a few feats to get red crate, the majority of players are counting key cards to ensure we can get gold, which is becoming harder.

Sure it's aimed at end game players, sure some feats are with the newest characters. That doesn't mean red crate is dependent on these characters and hardly "paywalled." I left off Nightsister feats because the only newish character required for that was Merrin, and news flash, a team that is designed to constantly revive means you can have her at 3* low gear. They must have realized people could spam sector one for it.

On that note, why show the percentages of who has those characters at g13? You don't need them that high to get the feats usually. We have yet to see what can be done for the all Phoenix one, but as has been discussed already, you can skip that feat if you can get enough others.

What percentage of >4 million GP players have Inquistors in relics? It will be larger than the 15% you quote. And if it still seems small, that's because of personal choice, not a paywall. They are over a year old. Even GI is now past his 1st birthday. The others have been accelerated for a few months now. There's been more than enough time to get them for free. You can't call it a paywall if you didn't get them because of personal choice. Especially when they outright TOLD US that Inquisitors would be needed gor Conquests and other events *more than a year ago.*

"Arrowsmith23;c-2430397" wrote:
So are you saying they aren't directly linking a large amount of feats to new characters?

You also missed out the nightsister feats. Regardless of which, by both of our admission you can cheese some feats. However that's not the design surely you can see that? CG don't make these feats with the intention of us being able to cheese them.

Just to throw out the stats for some of these characters for the benefit of some end game players that don't quite get how difficult it's getting for the rest of the community to play conquest when it comes to these feats

According to swgoh.gg: (at gear 13)
1% of the overall playerbase has Captain Rex
3% have characters like cere, cal, merrin, tarful
3% newest tuskens
6% have aphra requirements
15% have inquisitors
10% have hera at relics but 1% has chopper

So to suggest that achieving red crate isn't aimed for endgame players is laughable. Again I have no complaints about this but firstly recognise the reality and secondly while your looking how to cheese a few feats to get red crate, the majority of players are counting key cards to ensure we can get gold, which is becoming harder.

The very fact that nightsister zombie was in the last set of conquest conflicts with your statement "CG don't make these feats with the intention of us being able to cheese them." Zombie was removed from previous conquests ages ago because people were using those teams to cheese feats. They knew exactly what they were doing when they put her back in.

Nearly 100% of the player base has Captain Rex - not at G13, but how do you actually know that G13 is required? I didn't have Cal, Cere, Merrin, or the new Tuskens at 7* for the previous conquests and still managed those feats and I don't have Aphra at all, so had to skip those feats completely. I have guild mates that didn't have inquisitors at 7* and still managed most of those feats. I'm not sure why you're trying to make the case that G13 (or even G12) is required to get those feats - that's demonstrably false for previous conquests, and there's no reason as of right now to assume that it will be true for the phoenix feat. What you're calling "cheese" others might call "strategy".

Obviously CG wants red crate to be at least somewhat difficult - and rightfully so. If you're seeking the maximum possible rewards, you should expect that it's going to be challenging to get them. For end-game accounts or large, well developed rosters, generally speaking it's fairly easy to get red crate, if you put in the time and the planning to get it done. For these same accounts, getting gold crate is trivial to the point that that's where the effort stops for many that don't want to bother with conquest. I have several guild mates that target gold crate specifically because it requires so little effort while keeping them out of the travesty that is proving grounds. If you're making the case that getting gold crate is becoming more difficult, I'd counter that with, "are you sure your not just feeling less motivated?" If you're growing your roster, conquest shouldn't be getting harder - it should be getting easier.

"Arrowsmith23;c-2430502" wrote:
The usual CG fans proving my original point.. Pure nonsense to suggest they aren't tightening the grip on who can achieve red crates.

Telling me all the ways you can get around these feats, clearly designed for the latest and greatest using cheese, or 'strategy' to accomplish it, is missing the whole point.

The original word used by someone was tightening - feats that include caveats that require all players to survive is an example of 'tightening the grip'.

Right now you might be able to use 'strategy' to get past these feats but in 3/4 cycles time you probably won't be able to because that's clearly the intent. Similarly 3/4 cycles ago most players could achieve red crate are now having to look closely at achieving Gold. Just to say I always get gold, occasionally red however I'm now having to count to make sure I can, I'm not confident that with CG 'tightening the grip' that this will be possible in the not too distant future.

Just to emphasise, I have no problem with CG doing this, I agree that Red crate should be for the best and that I actually have no problem with a paywall or targetting the tip of the spear, the game relies on whales to keep going.

However the nonsense and passive aggressive comments that get aimed towards people that point out a clear reality or voice an opinion, sometimes even by the mods, is a problem.

You are just providing ideas out of thin air without any evidence to back it up. Three to four cycles ago was easier? That's all subjective. Inquisitor feats showed up right away when they were released... that was more than four cycles ago. Since then, there have been Conquest cycles that have appeared easier than the previous ones. The only obvious jump in difficulty was after the first two sets when the format was overhauled and the pass was introduced. Since then, there isn't any evidence that red crate has gotten steadily harder. Some seem harder, others easier. But again, that's all subjective.

Whether it's winning with Bad Batch or Captain Rex, seemingly gated feats have been around since the beginning, not just the last few cycles. People are bringing up cheese because it's relevant. These feats can still be cheesed just as they could when I used JML to get kills with 3* low gear Bad Batch characters so long ago. If the gated units was a tightening of grip, they'd end the cheese. They've relic gated Journey Guide events; there's nothing stopping them from relic gating feats. The only example of them tightening their grip is arguably the topic one of all the specific Phoenix units surviving. I'm reserving judgment on that though, since I've never used Rex at all, let alone seen if this was doable in sector 1 with the right disks.

"Arrowsmith23;c-2430502" wrote:

The usual CG fans proving my original point.. Pure nonsense to suggest they aren't tightening the grip on who can achieve red crates.

Telling me all the ways you can get around these feats, clearly designed for the latest and greatest using cheese, or 'strategy' to accomplish it, is missing the whole point.

No it's not - it's directly addressing the 'point' - conquest is dynamic and is SUPPOSED to change from one cycle to the next. Figuring out ways to adapt to the changes using strategies designed to play on the strengths of individual kits and disk combos is what conquest is all about. They aren't 'tightening the grip' they're keeping the game mode interesting for those people (like me) that care to figure it out and/or actually enjoy the game mode. How much more tiresome would conquest be if the feats never changed?

One thing no one seems to be mentioning here is that they brought back the single most powerful disk combo in the game for last conquest and it's still here - AA,VA,TE is basically easy mode - and you only REALLY need VA and TE. Having those disks in the game actually makes it easier for smaller rosters to get high crates in conquest because your characters don't have to survive for very long. So if they're 'tightening their grip' why are they opening that door that makes conquest so much easier?

As for being a 'CG fan' - you're enough of a fan of their product to come here and post about it, so if that's supposed to be an insult, it rings a bit hollow. I've got no problem admitting that I enjoy this game a great deal - if that weren't true, I wouldn't bother coming here.

Correct, I'm clearly a fan of CGs game and just to reiterate I'm not having a go at them or suggesting what they are doing is wrong. I'm just not a CG fan to an extent that if they said the sky was green, I'd have a go at anyone that suggested it was blue...

Again, there is nothing wrong with CG making conquest harder or creating lots of feats 'linked' (I won't use paywalled, clearly a trigger for some people) to the latest characters. But that is what's happening and that's the point people were making. It's a direction change clearly, cool - no problem, but let's not pretend that's not happening because they've put NS zombie back in!

Side point - nobody has mentioned a problem with changing feats.

Happy to agree to disagree about the subjective nature of the previous conquests. I suppose we will see in the near future if they start putting more feats in (like the phoenix one) that tighten the grip and start eliminating cheese.

Agree with the comment that gated feats have been around from the beginning, but where it was centred around one new character or faction and if you don't have them you accept those points are lost (or cheesed) now they have several gated factions around the latest characters and factions.

Inquisitors, yes they did make it clear they would be needed, I was just making the observation that 85% of the player base don't have them. It's not laziness that people don't get them there are just too many more important characters to chase. I'd also bet when that number hits around 30% of players having them reliced they will stop requiring them for conquest.

Just a final reminder - I'm not complaining about this change in direction just recognising it for what it is. The sky hasnt fallen, but it is still blue.

Anyway I'll let you all move on to the next different opinion someone has. Time will tell if they are 'tightening the grip' or not!

"DeusArt;c-2430595" wrote:

"BubbaFett;c-2430586" wrote:
I gold crate each Conquest.... It gets me the character the red crate dudes get, except one conquest later.... Cists ne nothing but $10 a conquest for the basic pass.... What's wrong with that?

This is how conquest works before. Only red crate was locked by new troons and that’s was great. Now I’m expect red&gold will be locked by them.

Have you played conquest yet? Have you started trying any of those feats that you think are "locked" behind new characters? A couple of people have already reported back that the captain rex feat looks attainable without significant investment in rex or the phoenix team.

"sloweagle;c-2430603" wrote:
Anecdotally I would say the conquest does become more difficult and more paywalled. It was easy to overshot key cards in earlier conquests, but recently I have to count and skip some feats to hit 630 exactly. That’s entirely reasonable for CG as the game needs paying players to sustain. For f2p players, or for newer players, it is also fun to strategize to achieve red crate. So personally I don’t really have problem with it, as long as CG doesn’t make it entirely impossible to get red crate for f2p, it is fun. So far I didn’t have to even 3 stars all nodes to get red crate, so I would expect even CG makes the current one a little hard, I can still do the red one as f2p.

Anecdotally being the keyword here. I was getting gold crates for Maul and Scion of Jango. After that, I started consistently getting red crate. I red crated all of Fury's. So, anecdotally.

I didn't keep notes on conquests so this is speaking from my memory. For at least the past 3 cycles, my 34 keycard wiggle room has been sufficient for me. There is usually 1 global feat, and 1-2 sector feats that are very difficult or require a lot of effort. I skip those. Everything else turns out fine. Some of them are seriously grindy for sure, but that's a matter of maintaining a schedule and has nothing to do with new toons or paywall. This new cycle is shaping up like that as well. And I have never even bought any pass.

So, obviously anecdotally, I do believe CG plans the keycards out. If a player either is able to maintain a consistent play schedule, or spends some money (far from whaling) to save time and gain flexibility, they can get the red crate every time.