Forum Discussion
"simgirl1010;c-16238936" wrote:
"catitude5;c-16238841" wrote:
"Cinebar;c-16216819" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16216607" wrote:
"LeGardePourpre;c-16216601" wrote:
"@Erpe;c-16216509" wrote:
"@Writin_Reg;c-16216498" wrote:
The Truth:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sims_(video_game)
Yes. 11.3 million sold copies sold of TS1 while TS2 only sold a little more than half of that.
The truth about The Sims 2 is a lot of copies were illegal copies, it was the era of the digital piracy for the video games, music and movies.
I think that there were more illegal copies of TS1 though.
Still the main customers for both TS1 and TS2 were very young girls who usually didn’t play other games and who usually knew very little about computers. Beside that they wanted everything as soon as it was released. So I think that the Sims games were pirated much less than other games.
I have to disagree with you that The Sims was purchased by very young girls. Will Wright and others have spoken about this, and they did want to market to young teen boys hoping to draw them into simulation games rather than the console games most young teen males at the time were playing.
But they found out it was grown women who were playing The Sims and not young teen girls and or teen boys, the majority of their customers (due to their own internal studies) showed it was women over 20+ and mainly middle aged. So, in the 2001 a middle aged woman would be around 40 considering the life span at that time. Young teen males were never the majority playing their games and neither were younger females.
I have to agree, why don't they realize that the young girls grew up? It's adults that play this game. They need to stop gearing it towards kids.
The young girls may have grown up but there's a whole new generation of young girls who are not interested in the complexities and dark humor of the past versions. They're the Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, Snapchat, instant gratification generation and EA is competing with the mobile industry to grab their attention for the PC version. They're not interested in developing complicated story lines or multi-generational families. I'm sure there are exceptions as evidenced by some younger forum members here but the majority probably don't invest the time that most forum members do. They buy the latest pack, play a while, and then they're back to their mobile games until the next pack releases. Those experienced long time simmers longing for the glory of past games had better face the reality that those days may be gone. And I fear those pinning their hopes on a Sims 5 are going to be sorely disappointed. Either because there won't be a Sims 5 or it's going to be even more directed along mobile/online play elements.
So just keep appealing to the youth so that Ash Ketchum and company never grows up?
News flash. The creator of The Sims meant the game to be enjoyed by not only teens but also adults. And anyone who has played TS1, TS2 and/or TS3 will tell you that it appeals to both audiences and always had since its beginning. So to continue down the new path TS4 created is to further say to the veterans, mature adult players of the series...Forget You! If that is the message you agree with fine but it's sad what has happened to Will Wright's awesome legacy where there was something for everyone.
Now the only thing left is for casual players who love goal-orientated simple games that need to be told how to play because they have no clue what to do in a sandbox gaming experience meant to truly PLAY WITH LIFE. What made The Sims unique is no longer present. It's just a shell of a game trying to reminisce about the glory days of when it used to be a life simulator not a fake imitator.
https://s25.postimg.org/m736syljz/square-peg.jpg- deleted.
- Well if anything, The Sims 5 should be the new era Sims 2 or a lot of people are going to be dissapointed, especially if they did the lackluster release day again. The Sims 4 Ratings shot down faster than an F-15 during it's first week release, especially when (according to wiki) you consider the fact that "...This was the most successful PC game launch the company had ever had to date".
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability)."Erpe;c-16240134" wrote:
"TheHavocado;c-16240016" wrote:
Well if anything, The Sims 5 should be the new era Sims 2 or a lot of people are going to be dissapointed, especially if they did the lackluster release day again. The Sims 4 Ratings shot down faster than an F-15 during it's first week release, especially when (according to wiki) you consider the fact that "...This was the most successful PC game launch the company had ever had to date".
The Sims games have always had low ratings in the reviews and among other gamers who never have understood why this game got high sales numbers at all when it in their eyes isn’t even a real game but more like a toy for mainly young girls (or a virtual dollhouse).
EA also clearly hadn’t expected TS1 to become successful at all. Therefore the budget for TS1 was very low which meant that its game world became very small and its graphics looked very simple and outdated too. The reasons was that EA only expected a part of the SimCity gamers to buy it. But what EA hadn’t foreseen was that TS1 suddenly attracted millions of young girls who never had played a game before.
TS3 may have had the most successful launch (most copies sold on its release day). But TS1 still sold almost twice as many copies. So TS1 must clearly be the most successful game that EA ever launched.
The high sales numbers for TS3 on day one was caused by the open seamless world. But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead. Maybe it will be something about ”the option to play and cooperate with your friends in the game”.
Why on earth should I continue playing Sims 3 when there would be a new great Sims game with new content and improvements and open world? I’d jump over to that new game immediately. It’s not open world (or CASt) that keeps me playing Sims 3. It’s the lack of a better alternative. I’ve tried the alternative and then returned. There was only one reason for that: while Sims 4 made me constantly go ‘what shal I do now..., oh what shall I do next’, then closing the game after two hours tops, my Sims 3 game sort of plays itself and I only quit because I have to go to bed. If they’d deliver a new game that does that, open world or not, Sims 3 could retire."Erpe;c-16240176" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240153" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16240134" wrote:
"TheHavocado;c-16240016" wrote:
Well if anything, The Sims 5 should be the new era Sims 2 or a lot of people are going to be dissapointed, especially if they did the lackluster release day again. The Sims 4 Ratings shot down faster than an F-15 during it's first week release, especially when (according to wiki) you consider the fact that "...This was the most successful PC game launch the company had ever had to date".
The Sims games have always had low ratings in the reviews and among other gamers who never have understood why this game got high sales numbers at all when it in their eyes isn’t even a real game but more like a toy for mainly young girls (or a virtual dollhouse).
EA also clearly hadn’t expected TS1 to become successful at all. Therefore the budget for TS1 was very low which meant that its game world became very small and its graphics looked very simple and outdated too. The reasons was that EA only expected a part of the SimCity gamers to buy it. But what EA hadn’t foreseen was that TS1 suddenly attracted millions of young girls who never had played a game before.
TS3 may have had the most successful launch (most copies sold on its release day). But TS1 still sold almost twice as many copies. So TS1 must clearly be the most successful game that EA ever launched.
The high sales numbers for TS3 on day one was caused by the open seamless world. But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead. Maybe it will be something about ”the option to play and cooperate with your friends in the game”.
Why on earth should I continue playing Sims 3 when there would be a new great Sims game with new content and improvements and open world? I’d jump over to that new game immediately. It’s not open world (or CASt) that keeps me playing Sims 3. It’s the lack of a better alternative. I’ve tried the alternative and then returned. There was only one reason for that: while Sims 4 made me constantly go ‘what shal I do now..., oh what shall I do next’, then closing the game after two hours tops, my Sims 3 game sort of plays itself and I only quit because I have to go to bed. If they’d deliver a new game that does that, open world or not, Sims 3 could retire.
I didn’t write that to you and you seem to have misunderstood me.
The reason that I don’t play TS4 isn’t about the missing open world either and we seem to agree about what is wrong with TS4. That wasn’t my point.
But if TS5 is marketed as “a new Sims game similar to Sims 3 and with the open world returning” then it will get low sales numbers and especially if the EPs are just repetions too. Not because you won’t buy it because I am sure that you actually would :) But because most young teens would reject the game. Partly because they won’t like an attempt from EA to revive an old game - and partly because they would have wanted something new instead and think that EA must have run out of ideas :)
For us here in the forum such things aren’t really so important because we are the hardcore fans who most likely will buy almost anything. But for new young simmers without much money and with a lot of other interests too in their lives things are different. They won’t just throw out their sparce money on a game that doesn’t seem to have anything new to offer to them.
I know you didn't directly adress me but regardless, the statement
"But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead."
begged for a reaction, because any simmer who's playing Sims 3 right now will probably confirm what I said. It's your theory EA has to have a brand new selling point to be able to sell the game and heck, for all we know EA agrees with you and thinks so too. I don't agree with that theory though, I don't think that's how it works for simmers. As long as they give us an immersive game that allows us to play with little people in a creative way, we're happy. In fact one of Sims 4's most popular selling claims among fans was 'back to its roots'.
Your theory (and who knows EA's theory) denies the fact that a community and sharing is highly important for simmers. The TS3 section is great, with lovely/sweet people sharing both information and experiences, but we're also sharing history. There is the occasional "Did you know that..." - "No, I didn't! Wow, got to try that!" but for the rest we're all stuck in the past. It's a beautiful past, I love that past, but that doesn't mean I - or anyone else - wouldn't rather move on. Playing Sims 3 has become a shelter, a place to turn to in absence of something better. Suggesting people who play the old games (regardless the version) do so out of lack of a will to move on/adjust/change, means you're shortchanging them and don't understand what they're coming from and it even denies their actual issues in a way.
And that's us oldies. When they'll announce Sims 5 it will be like 2020 earliest. Those young teens you're referring to will be kids who never played Sims 3, nor know the game. Open world will be a brand new concept for them.- MidnightAura86New Spectator
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way" "JoAnne65;c-16240287" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16240176" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240153" wrote:
"Erpe;c-16240134" wrote:
"TheHavocado;c-16240016" wrote:
Well if anything, The Sims 5 should be the new era Sims 2 or a lot of people are going to be dissapointed, especially if they did the lackluster release day again. The Sims 4 Ratings shot down faster than an F-15 during it's first week release, especially when (according to wiki) you consider the fact that "...This was the most successful PC game launch the company had ever had to date".
The Sims games have always had low ratings in the reviews and among other gamers who never have understood why this game got high sales numbers at all when it in their eyes isn’t even a real game but more like a toy for mainly young girls (or a virtual dollhouse).
EA also clearly hadn’t expected TS1 to become successful at all. Therefore the budget for TS1 was very low which meant that its game world became very small and its graphics looked very simple and outdated too. The reasons was that EA only expected a part of the SimCity gamers to buy it. But what EA hadn’t foreseen was that TS1 suddenly attracted millions of young girls who never had played a game before.
TS3 may have had the most successful launch (most copies sold on its release day). But TS1 still sold almost twice as many copies. So TS1 must clearly be the most successful game that EA ever launched.
The high sales numbers for TS3 on day one was caused by the open seamless world. But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead. Maybe it will be something about ”the option to play and cooperate with your friends in the game”.
Why on earth should I continue playing Sims 3 when there would be a new great Sims game with new content and improvements and open world? I’d jump over to that new game immediately. It’s not open world (or CASt) that keeps me playing Sims 3. It’s the lack of a better alternative. I’ve tried the alternative and then returned. There was only one reason for that: while Sims 4 made me constantly go ‘what shal I do now..., oh what shall I do next’, then closing the game after two hours tops, my Sims 3 game sort of plays itself and I only quit because I have to go to bed. If they’d deliver a new game that does that, open world or not, Sims 3 could retire.
I didn’t write that to you and you seem to have misunderstood me.
The reason that I don’t play TS4 isn’t about the missing open world either and we seem to agree about what is wrong with TS4. That wasn’t my point.
But if TS5 is marketed as “a new Sims game similar to Sims 3 and with the open world returning” then it will get low sales numbers and especially if the EPs are just repetions too. Not because you won’t buy it because I am sure that you actually would :) But because most young teens would reject the game. Partly because they won’t like an attempt from EA to revive an old game - and partly because they would have wanted something new instead and think that EA must have run out of ideas :)
For us here in the forum such things aren’t really so important because we are the hardcore fans who most likely will buy almost anything. But for new young simmers without much money and with a lot of other interests too in their lives things are different. They won’t just throw out their sparce money on a game that doesn’t seem to have anything new to offer to them.
I know you didn't directly adress me but regardless, the statement
"But EA can’t ever get a similar success just by advertising the next Sims game as ”The return of the open world” anyway because the simmers who loved it then most likely will just stay with TS3 instead. So EA needs something new to use in the advertising instead."
begged for a reaction, because any simmer who's playing Sims 3 right now will probably confirm what I said. It's your theory EA has to have a brand new selling point to be able to sell the game and heck, for all we know EA agrees with you and thinks so too. I don't agree with that theory though, I don't think that's how it works for simmers. As long as they give us an immersive game that allows us to play with little people in a creative way, we're happy. In fact one of Sims 4's most popular selling claims among fans was 'back to its roots'.
Your theory (and who knows EA's theory) denies the fact that a community and sharing is highly important for simmers. The TS3 section is great, with lovely/sweet people sharing both information and experiences, but we're also sharing history. There is the occasional "Did you know that..." - "No, I didn't! Wow, got to try that!" but for the rest we're all stuck in the past. It's a beautiful past, I love that past, but that doesn't mean I - or anyone else - wouldn't rather move on. Playing Sims 3 has become a shelter, a place to turn to in absence of something better. Suggesting people who play the old games (regardless the version) do so out of lack of a will to move on/adjust/change, means you're shortchanging them and don't understand what they're coming from and it even denies their actual issues in a way.
And that's us oldies. When they'll announce Sims 5 it will be like 2020 earliest. Those young teens you're referring to will be kids who never played Sims 3, nor know the game. Open world will be a brand new concept for them.
The reason why we see things differently is mainly that you concentrate on what the forum here thinks. But by doing this you completely ignore the fact that if only the forum (or even 10 times as many simmers) bought the game then EA wouldn’t be able to support the game anymore without losing hundreds of millions of dollars.
So what EA concentrates about is of course instead the about 6 million other simmers all over the world. Most of those simmers aren’t hardcore simmers at all but instead mostly young experimenting new simmers who just bought the game because they found something in the advertising interesting. They usually play much less then people here do and they only buy something if it looks interesting.
Those simmers are also the reason why EA now regularly releases new content in the free updates because the reason for this clearly is to get lost simmers back to playing the game (and hopefully also buy a little more expansions). EA surely doesn’t use money on such things just to be kind to the few hardcore simmers in this forum ;)
We can guess about the the release day of TS5 all we want. Simmers have always thought that the next Sims game was many years out in the future and become very surprised when EA announced it years before they expected. The reason of course is that simmers always want the current Sims game to be “complete” before EA moves on. But EA has never agreed with this idea and instead just announced the next big Sims game to avoid that sales numbers for new expansion become too low and then released the new game 15 months after the announcement. So I expect EA to announce TS5 in the middle of this year and then release it next year anyway. But you are welcome to believe that EA just will go on releasing 4 SPs, 2 GPs and an EP each year forever until new simmers will have to buy hundreds of such expansions just to get a “complete” Sims 4 game :)"MidnightAura;c-16240302" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16240107" wrote:
"simgirl1010;c-16239723" wrote:
"JoAnne65;c-16239685" wrote:
@rudy8292 Missed your post (was typing while you posted), lol, yeah, we’re kidding about it but I must admit if anything it actually makes me angry. Leaving essential things out and then acting like simmers should be greatful? I realize not everything in predecessors is automatically in a successor, I don’t even expect that, but toddlers, pools, ghosts, family tree? And then selling it as a generous gesture those things were added later and for free? I even think that’s kind of rude.
@MidnightAura Yes, by Grant and also by Rachel Franklin. It’s just not professional. You can say “we’ve tried to improve this”, but you’re just not going to downplay your previous work. It’s beyond me why anyone in any business would consider that a good idea. I know I’d really get in trouble at work if I’d do something like that and I work in a non profit organisation. And above all, it’s so not true that it makes things even sadder. Hoping nobody would notice, lol, yeah, well, you won’t get away with that with us hardcore casual players :p Maybe the ‘real gamers’ will buy it.
So what exactly do you think will be the fallout from those comments? How are they "not going to get away with it?"
That nobody would notice (my comment was a reaction to that assumption). I think non simmers may not notice and believe it blindly (hey, if an expert says so), but simmers - their cursomers - do. I’ve had a feeling before by the way Grant isn’t a simmer himself, often doesn’t know what he’s talking about and doesn’t get at all what it’s about. I truely think this is just his job, but that from a gamer’s perspective his interests lie elsewhere. That’s bad because as a result (he’s not the only one, Rachel Franklin didn’t get it either) they’ve turned this franchise into something many simmers don’t want and though others do, I see them expressing criticism that in my opinion is very justified (like the thread about instructions falling out of queue, and the lack of options, openness and customizability).
I think that is a huge problem with the sims 4. The people making it don't play it. Or at best don't play it a lot. Watch a live stream and its obvious by the amount of information that is given out that is not correct. For example in one of the recent live streams one of the guru's said teens can't live on their own. But they can because they themselves gave us that option. Very weird thing to state with such confidence that teens can't live on their own. You think they would know that. Perhaps it was a mistake and people are only human but its a weird thing to not know about your own game.
My husband works in game development. When he is working on a project he eat, sleeps and breathes it and he can tell you all kinds of weird and random facts about it. But then he plays the games he develops even if he left the company tomorrow he would continue to play the games.
Colossal Order who make Cities Skylines are another example. Their developers play their games and it shows. They have a passion for their games and they actually listen to and engage with their players in a very open way which I love. If they made a sims game I would be in heaven!
The sims 4 on the other hand like you say has went a different road from the previous games and as much as it likes to be denied by some there is no doubt a lot of players are not impressed with this offering. When I play the Sims 2 its so obvious how much love was put into this game, the amount of detail is astounding. It did continue in sims 3 but not in quite the same way but again the amount of gameplay and little details we got are amazing. Now look at the sims 4, cut out so many little details and vital game play and instead we get a half baked version of previous features. Look at the elevators, look at the boat for travel. Actually scratch that I refuse to call the boat a form of transport when the reality is its a cut screen the second your sims get halfway to it. Not to mention the tone had changed. The creativity has gone and its more "play our way or the high way"
Oddly Grant also worked on Sims 2 and in fact used to be one of the more popular devs. LOL.- icemanfreshSeasoned NewcomerI actually don't remember Grant from the Sims 2 days, but there were so many of them. I remember Luc the most, although he probably left midway.
I did a search on MaxoidGrant and there were some archives on SnootySims about him posting promotional material on Sims 2 Pets, like blogs and news updates. So I guess he was involved in a previous pets expansion
It's nice to walk down memory lane, but I'm also looking forward to the future. With the teaser coming up, I hope Grant's right about us getting exciting new content
About The Sims 4 General Discussion
Join lively discussions, share tips, and exchange experiences on Sims 4 Expansion Packs, Game Packs, Stuff Packs & Kits.33,080 PostsLatest Activity: 9 hours ago
Related Posts
Recent Discussions
- 6 minutes ago
- 7 minutes ago
- 8 minutes ago
- 10 minutes ago
- 12 minutes ago